From huw.softdesigns@gmail.com Tue May 1 06:41:25 2018 From: huw.softdesigns@gmail.com (Huw Lloyd) Date: Tue, 1 May 2018 14:41:25 +0100 Subject: [Xmca-l] conscious and unconscious aspects of perspective (was Re: Re: Thank you to Peter) Message-ID: Peter, P I Zinchenko's work on voluntary and involuntary memory relates implicit and explicit learning through activity. It was a significant contribution to the development of activity theory. Implicit learning on its own is probably limited in its use. However, it is when it is combined with conscious inquiry that more interesting circumstances can emerge. Part of my effort is to demonstrate clear indices of orientation, helping to reveal the actual and desirable relation between an agent and an object of interest. Clearer recognition of this may be applied to institutions to help reverse the myopic attention on performance metrics that disregard issues of genuine understanding, craftsmanship, ethics etc. Best, Huw On 27 April 2018 at 17:44, Peter Feigenbaum [Staff] wrote: > What I'm about to suggest may seem far afield of the discussion that has > taken place on this > particular topic thus far, but the thought was triggered by Huw's mention > of perspective-taking. > > Whenever I think about teaching and learning, I can't help but conjure up > the ideas revealed > by Arthur Reber's work on *implicit* learning. In contrast to didactic > teaching - in this case, the > conscious efforts and aims of the caregivers to teach the child to walk - > there is the child's > own unconscious efforts to understand the activity in which she is engaged. > These two forms > of cognition, one conscious and the other unconscious, are apparently at > odds with one another. > > Reber considers implicit learning as "knowledge [that] is optimally > acquired independently of > conscious efforts to learn." Interestingly, when children and adults in his > experiments were asked > to divulge what they were thinking while they were engaged in a task > involving implicit learning > (such as learning the rules of an artificial grammar), they were largely > unable to do so, and > their task performance simultaneously suffered. > > For my part, I believe that both of these cognitive processes and > perspectives are operative > in social situations involving teaching and learning. Perhaps others would > find it useful to consider > these competing forms of learning when thinking about the zoped (or should > I say zoned?). > > Sorry if this idea is a distraction! > > Peter F > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 27, 2018 at 6:59 AM, Huw Lloyd > wrote: > > > Yes, HMF as something discrete is a red herring (and more a result of > > construing it in a categorical fashion). Better to consider it as a > > conjoining perspective. The chalk drawing is nicely evocative of > different > > perspectives at play (what I call active orientation because > 'perspective' > > and 'goal' connote conscious functions in English). I am working on a > > technical account of it all, and so have some confidence in my > assertions. > > > > Best, > > Huw > > > > > > > > On 27 April 2018 at 11:41, Peter Smagorinsky wrote: > > > > > But I suspect that walking can play a role in developing a higher > mental > > > process (psych function). A hunter walks in a way quite different from > a > > > yuppie doing a power walk, and each serves a cultural purpose. There's > > more > > > to the walk than just walking, I think. So yes, I do see a ZND at work > > when > > > learning how to walk in a goal-directed way, mediated by surroundings > > both > > > physical and psychological, that allow for entry into and participation > > in > > > a community of practice. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@ > > > mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole > > > Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2018 10:59 PM > > > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > > > Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Thank you to Peter > > > > > > Now of only walking were a higher psychological function, Peg, Peter > > might > > > call that a zone of nearest development! > > > > > > Or it might be seen as a kind of construction forest. :-) > > > > > > mike > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Apr 26, 2018 at 5:45 PM, Peg Griffin > > wrote: > > > > > > > Apropos of Martin's observation of walking: Here is a slide of a > > > > Rembrandt drawing. I use it when starting to work with people who > are > > > > or are planning to teach young children, especially if they are quite > > > > convinced that modeling the correct language or other behavior is > > > > essential and pretty much all that is essentially needed. > > > > There are a few casual notes under the slide that are just my > attempts > > > > to get them to relax into some disconcerting-for-them viewpoints. > > > > Peg > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@ > > > > mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Martin Packer > > > > Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2018 7:11 PM > > > > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > > > > Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Thank you to Peter > > > > > > > > I was thinking something similar, Henry. This seems to me one of > those > > > > rare occasions where Vygotsky doesn?t have it quite right. I spend > > > > quite a bit of time watching kids walking with adults, because it?s a > > > > phenomenon I find quite fascinating. A child using a table for > support > > > > while starting to walk is quite different from the ways that adults > > > > will actively help a child to walk, performing functions, such as > > > > balance, that the child is not yet capable of alone. Then, when the > > > > child *is* capable of walking alone, the adults have to be even more > > > > active: everyone knows that a toddler will head off in any direction > > > > that attracts their interest: now adults need to be what I think > Bowlby > > > called an ?external ego.? > > > > > > > > Martin > > > > > > > > > On Apr 26, 2018, at 5:56 PM, HENRY SHONERD > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Peter, et. al. > > > > > In the text from Vygotsky, the ?external objects? the child is > > > > > making > > > > use of might be an ?affordance? as per J.J. Gibson? Something else > > > > comes to my mind in a child learning to walk is the risk of serious > > > > injury. Most adults would probably not knowingly let the child risk > > > > such injury. That would be endangerment in a court of law. > > > > > Henry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> On Apr 26, 2018, at 2:02 PM, mike cole wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >> Thanks Peter! > > > > >> Mike > > > > >> > > > > >> On Thu, Apr 26, 2018 at 12:59 PM Peter Smagorinsky > > > > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >>> In case anyone is interested in LSV's use of scaffolding, Rene > > > > >>> sent me > > > > the > > > > >>> following. But it seems clear to me that he's not using it as > > > > >>> Bruner > > > > did. > > > > >>> The scaffolding here is not designed by an adult, but rather > > > > >>> involves a child's use of available supports. The words might be > > > > >>> more or less the same, but the concept seems very different to > me. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> See p. 226 of my Understanding Vygotsky (1991, with Valsiner), > > > > >>> where I observed that Vygotsky used the scaffolding metaphor in > > > > >>> chapter 3 of Vygotsky & Luria (Studies in the history of > > > > >>> behaviour: Ape, primitive, man,1930, p. 202). > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> And this is the text: > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> Let us recall how the child gradually learns to walk. As soon as > > > > >>> his muscles are strong enough, he begins to move about on the > > > > >>> ground in the same primitive manner as animals, using a naturally > > > > >>> innate mode of locomotion. He crawls on all fours; indeed one of > > > > >>> the leading > > > > pedologists > > > > >>> of our day says that the very young child reminds us of a small > > > > quadruped, > > > > >>> rather like an ?ape-like cat?. [39]That animal continues for some > > > > >>> time > > > > to > > > > >>> move about in the same primitive manner; within a few months, > > > > >>> however, > > > > it > > > > >>> begins to stand up on its legs: the child has started to walk. > The > > > > >>> transition to walking is usually not clear-cut. At first the > child > > > > makes > > > > >>> use of external objects, by holding on to them: he makes his way > > > > >>> along holding onto the edge of the bed, an adult?s hand, a chair, > > > > >>> pulling the chair along behind him and leaning on it. In a word, > > > > >>> his ability to > > > > walk is > > > > >>> not yet complete: it is in fact still surrounded, as it were, by > > > > >>> the scaffolding of those external tools with which it was > created. > > > > >>> Within a month or two, however, the child grows out of that > > > > >>> scaffolding, > > > > discarding > > > > >>> it, as no more external help is needed; external tools have now > > > > >>> been replaced by newly formed internal neurodynamic processes. > > > > >>> Having > > > > developed > > > > >>> strong legs, sufficient stability and coordination of movement, > > > > >>> the > > > > child > > > > >>> has now moved into the stage of definitive walking. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> -----Original Message----- > > > > >>> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto: > > > > >>> xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole > > > > >>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2018 12:58 PM > > > > >>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > > > > >>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Thank you to Peter > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> Makes good sense to me, Rob. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> I do not have the same problem with proximal that Peter does, but > > > > >>> emphasizing the temporal ordering seems certainly right. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> With respect to scaffolding: The russian term is ???????????? > ???? > > > > >>> - literally, "construction forests" -- think of the "scaffolding" > > > > >>> around public buildings that block the sidewalks and are a > > > > >>> "forest" of pipes > > > > and > > > > >>> boards. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> Beats a gallows by a verst or two! > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> BUT, beware that Vygotsky and Luria, among others, used this very > > > > >>> term > > > > at > > > > >>> times. There is interesting work by Arthur Bakkar and Anna > Shvarts > > > > >>> on > > > > this > > > > >>> very topic that I am hoping to get represented in MCA. Arthur has > > > > written > > > > >>> on this topic with empirical work in classrooms and makes a case > > > > >>> for a broad use of the term that converges very closely with. If > > > > >>> there is interest here, let me know, and i can post one of his > > > papers. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> mike > > > > >>> > > > > >>> (the guy who believes that the proper English concept is a zoped) > > > > >>> :-) > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2018 at 3:56 AM, robsub@ariadne.org.uk > > > >>> robsub@ariadne.org.uk> < robsub@ariadne.org.uk > > > >>> robsub@ariadne.org.uk>> wrote: > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> I just want to say thank you to Peter for introducing me to > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> "Deconflating the ZPD and instructional scaffolding". > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www. > > researchgate.net_p&d=DwIFaQ&c=aqMfXOEvEJQh2iQMCb7Wy8l0sPnURk > > cqADc2guUW8IM&r=mXj3yhpYNklTxyN3KioIJ0ECmPHilpf4N2p9PBMATWs&m= > > A0pLAA7WgwdNaLaEVN98QsUJr8_J2xw1Bxg5KM9ej2s&s= > > WSjaQM3CNl982j1B7mkB8BvsZuf0uca_3zOIioVDXkM&e= > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> ublication/320579162_Deconflating_the_ZPD_and_instructional_ > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> scaffolding_Retranslating_and_reconceiving_the_zone_of_proxi > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> mal_development_as_the_zone_of_next_development > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> I have felt for a long time that there was something not quite > > > > >>>> right > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> about the way people conceive of both the ZPD (or, as I shall > now > > > > >>>> call > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> it, the > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> ZND) and instructional scaffolding, but lacked the expertise to > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> analyse why. Now Peter comes and, with great authority, tells me > > > > >>>> that > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> I was thinking along the right lines. The irony of now being > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> officially A Retired Person is that I have the leisure to study > > > > >>>> these > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> things in the detail I needed when I was working and did not > have > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>> time..... > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> Just a couple of random thoughts around my reading of the > article. > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> I have always felt that "scaffolding" was a misnomer, a bad > > > > >>>> choice of > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> metaphor by those who originally coined it. The point of > > > > >>>> scaffolding, > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> the stuff you put on buildings, is that it is inflexible. It is > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> massive, rigid, and designed never to fall over with a worker on > > it. > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> Although I have never quite been in tune with the idea of > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> instructional scaffolding, it has always seemed to me that its > > > > >>>> point > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> must be flexibility - taking bits away from it must be at least > > > > >>>> as > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> important as putting them there in the first place. So, whenever > > > > >>>> I > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> think about instructional scaffolding, I first have to get past > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>> jarring metaphor. Perhaps I am too sensitive to words. > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> I wonder also if the popularity of the "assisted-learning-today, > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> independent-performance-tomorrow" model is not just popularity > > > > >>>> with > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> teachers of teaching. Its short term focus and superficial > > > > >>>> specificity > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> make it appear to be very measurable, which makes it popular > with > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> policy makers, especially in today's audit culture. > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> The introduction of Moll and the idea of context being crucial > > > > >>>> was > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> also very illuminating. Something else for me to examine, > dammit. > > > > >>>> But > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> also something that becomes obvious once it is pointed out > > > > >>>> because > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> CHAT and the activity triangle are all about context. > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> This quote from p73 gives me pause for thought too. "Assuming > > > > >>>> that > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> instructional scaffolding will work because it is written into a > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> lesson plan overlooks the possibility that teacher and learner > > > > >>>> will > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> approach each other in ways that produce conflict over product > > > > >>>> and > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> process, with the student inevitably losing. Scaffolding, then, > > > > >>>> needs > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> to be viewed as an intensely relational process, one requiring > > > > >>>> mutual > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> understanding and negotiation of goals and practices." Teachers > > > > >>>> know > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> that (I would say) but policy makers, at least in this country, > > > don't. > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> They love lesson plans and teachers are coerced into achieving > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> aims in the lesson plan regardless of where the lesson is > > > > >>>> actually > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> going. The disjunction between what we know to be good teaching > > > > >>>> on the > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> one hand, and, on the other, the requirements of neoliberal > audit > > > > >>> culture, becomes ever more stark. > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> I hope I am making sense. > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Peter Feigenbaum, Ph.D. > Director, > Office of Institutional Research > > Fordham University > Thebaud Hall-202 > Bronx, NY 10458 > > Phone: (718) 817-2243 > Fax: (718) 817-3817 > email: pfeigenbaum@fordham.edu > From mcole@ucsd.edu Tue May 1 08:55:37 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Tue, 01 May 2018 15:55:37 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Fwd: Happy Birthday, Karl Marx In-Reply-To: <6F6AF86F-F631-4BD3-8BDA-2E977FAF9A9C@gmail.com> References: <6F6AF86F-F631-4BD3-8BDA-2E977FAF9A9C@gmail.com> Message-ID: Greetings on the International workers day Mike *THE NEW YORK TIMES* Opinion - - - - - - 485 THE STONE Happy Birthday, Karl Marx. You Were Right! By Jason Barker Mr. Barker is an associate professor of philosophy. April 30, 2018 Image CreditRalf Hirschberger/European Pressphoto Agency SEOUL, South Korea ? On May 5, 1818, in the southern German town of Trier, in the picturesque wine-growing region of the Moselle Valley, Karl Marx was born. At the time Trier was one-tenth the size it is today, with a population of around 12,000. According to one of Marx?s recent biographers, J?rgen Neffe, Trier is one of those towns where ?although everyone doesn?t know everyone, many know a lot about many.? Such provincial constraints were no match for Marx?s boundless intellectual enthusiasm. Rare were the radical thinkers of the major European capitals of his day that he either failed to meet or would fail to break with on theoretical grounds, including his German contemporaries Wilhelm Weitling and Bruno Bauer; the French ?bourgeois socialist? Pierre-Joseph Proudhon, as Marx and Friedrich Engels would label him in their ?Communist Manifesto?; and the Russian anarchist Mikhail Bakunin. In 1837 Marx reneged on the legal career that his father, himself a lawyer, had mapped out for him and immersed himself instead in the speculative philosophy of G.W.F. Hegel at the University of Berlin. One might say that it was all downhill from there. The deeply conservative Prussian government didn?t take kindly to such revolutionary thinking (Hegel?s philosophy advocated a rational liberal state), and by the start of the next decade Marx?s chosen career path as a university professor had been blocked. If ever there were a convincing case to be made for the dangers of philosophy, then surely it?s Marx?s discovery of Hegel, whose ?grotesque craggy melody? repelled him at first but which soon had him dancing deliriously through the streets of Berlin. As Marx confessed to his father in an equally delirious letter in November 1837, ?I wanted to embrace every person standing on the street-corner.? [Receive the day?s most urgent debates right in your inbox by subscribing to the Opinion Today newsletter.] As we reach the bicentennial of Marx?s birth, what lessons might we draw from his dangerous and delirious philosophical legacy? What precisely is Marx?s lasting contribution? Today the legacy would appear to be alive and well. Since the turn of the millennium countless books have appeared, from scholarly works to popular biographies, broadly endorsing Marx?s reading of capitalism and its enduring relevance to our neoliberal age. In 2002, the French philosopher Alain Badiou declared at a conference I attended in London that Marx had become the philosopher of the middle class. What did he mean? I believe he meant that educated liberal opinion is today more or less unanimous in its agreement that Marx?s basic thesis ? that capitalism is driven by a deeply divisive class struggle in which the ruling-class minority appropriates the surplus labor of the working-class majority as profit ? is correct. Even liberal economists such as Nouriel Roubini agree that Marx?s conviction that capitalism has an inbuilt tendency to destroy itself remains as prescient as ever. But this is where the unanimity abruptly ends. While most are in agreement about Marx?s diagnosis of capitalism, opinion on how to treat its ?disorder? is thoroughly divided. And this is where Marx?s originality and profound importance as a philosopher lies. First, let?s be clear: Marx arrives at no magic formula for exiting the enormous social and economic contradictions that global capitalism entails (according to Oxfam, 82 percent of the global wealth generated in 2017 went to the world?s richest 1 percent). What Marx did achieve, however, through his self-styled materialist thought, were the critical weapons for undermining capitalism?s ideological claim to be the only game in town. In the ?Communist Manifesto,? Marx and Engels wrote: ?The bourgeoisie has stripped of its halo every occupation hitherto honored and looked up to with reverent awe. It has converted the physician, the lawyer, the priest, the poet, the man of science, into its paid wage laborers.? Marx was convinced that capitalism would soon make relics of them. The inroads that artificial intelligence is currently making into medical diagnosis and surgery, for instance, bears out the argument in the ?Manifesto? that technology would greatly accelerate the ?division of labor,? or the deskilling of such professions. To better understand how Marx achieved his lasting global impact ? an impact arguably greater and wider than any other philosopher?s before or after him ? we can begin with his relationship to Hegel. What was it about Hegel?s work that so captivated Marx? As he informed his father, early encounters with Hegel?s ?system,? which builds itself upon layer after layer of negations and contradictions, hadn?t entirely won him over. Marx found that the late-18th-century idealisms of Immanuel Kant and Johann Gottlieb Fichte that so dominated philosophical thinking in the early 19th century prioritized thinking itself ? so much so that reality could be inferred through intellectual reasoning. But Marx refused to endorse their reality. In an ironic Hegelian twist, it was the complete opposite: It was the material world that determined all thinking. As Marx puts it in his letter, ?If previously the gods had dwelt above the earth, now they became its center.? The idea that God ? or ?gods?? dwelt among the masses, or was ?in? them, was of course nothing philosophically new. But Marx?s innovation was to stand idealistic deference ? not just to God but to any divine authority ? on its head. Whereas Hegel had stopped at advocating a rational liberal state, Marx would go one stage further: Since the gods were no longer divine, there was no need for a state at all. The idea of the classless and stateless society would come to define both Marx?s and Engels?s idea of communism, and of course the subsequent and troubled history of the Communist ?states? (ironically enough!) that materialized during the 20th century. There is still a great deal to be learned from their disasters, but their philosophical relevance remains doubtful, to say the least. The key factor in Marx?s intellectual legacy in our present-day society is not ?philosophy? but ?critique,? or what he described in 1843 as ?the ruthless criticism of all that exists: ruthless both in the sense of not being afraid of the results it arrives at and in the sense of being just as little afraid of conflict with the powers that be.? ?The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways; the point is to change it,? he wrote in 1845. Racial and sexual oppression have been added to the dynamic of class exploitation. Social justice movements like Black Lives Matter and #MeToo, owe something of an unspoken debt to Marx through their unapologetic targeting of the ?eternal truths? of our age. Such movements recognize, as did Marx, that the ideas that rule every society are those of its ruling class and that overturning those ideas is fundamental to true revolutionary progress. We have become used to the go-getting mantra that to effect social change we first have to change ourselves. But enlightened or rational thinking is not enough, since the norms of thinking are already skewed by the structures of male privilege and social hierarchy, even down to the language we use. Changing those norms entails changing the very foundations of society. To cite Marx, ?No social order is ever destroyed before all the productive forces for which it is sufficient have been developed, and new superior relations of production never replace older ones before the material conditions for their existence have matured within the framework of the old society.? The transition to a new society where relations among people, rather than capital relations, finally determine an individual?s worth is arguably proving to be quite a task. Marx, as I have said, does not offer a one-size-fits-all formula for enacting social change. But he does offer a powerful intellectual acid test for that change. On that basis, we are destined to keep citing him and testing his ideas until the kind of society that he struggled to bring about, and that increasing numbers of us now desire, is finally realized. Jason Barker is an associate professor of philosophy at Kyung Hee University in South Korea and author of the novel ?Marx Returns .? From mcole@ucsd.edu Tue May 1 16:51:41 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Tue, 1 May 2018 16:51:41 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Fwd: Society for Qualitative Inquiry in Psychology Annual Conference In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Those of you in the area might be interested in this conference. Seems that M. Packer of xmca fame will be talking there. mike ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Elizabeth Fein Date: Tue, May 1, 2018 at 2:19 PM Subject: Society for Qualitative Inquiry in Psychology Annual Conference To: QUAL@listserv.temple.edu Dear members of the SQIP community, Attached please find a poster for our Annual Conference, to be held at Duquesne University on May 21st and 22nd, with a pre-conference workshop by Fred Wertz on the 20th on "Doing Phenomenological Analysis in Psychology". The full program can be viewed on our website at http://qualpsy.org/events/ 2018-conference/sqip-2018-conference-program/ Please feel free to circulate widely. We hope to see many of you in May! Best, Elizabeth Fein, Ph.D. Communications Officer Society for Qualitative Inquiry in Psychology -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: SQIP2018PosterFinal.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 330099 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180501/7f94f286/attachment-0001.pdf From bferholt@gmail.com Wed May 2 06:24:16 2018 From: bferholt@gmail.com (Beth Ferholt) Date: Wed, 2 May 2018 09:24:16 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Master Class with Michael Cole: The Story of LCHC -- May 12 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: A reminder about this event -- We invite you to participate in a Master Class with Michael Cole on Culture, Development, and the Social Creation of Social Inequality: A Polyphonic Autobiography, and, more broadly, the history and legacy of LCHC. Two members at the lab and different times ?Lois Holzman from the Rockefeller University days in the 1970s and Beth Ferholt most recently in the 2000s -- will join Mike in the class. We three are wanting to learn how people are responding to the document: What resonates, what?s confusing, what?s relevant to the current day and to the work that we all do, etc. The 90-minute conversation will take place Saturday, May 12, 11:00 ? 12:30 PM EDT. It will be uploaded to the MCA website and kept there for future use. If you are interested in registering for this class, please send an email to lholzman@eastsideinstitute.org and we will send you further information including the instructions for entering the Zoom conversation. Do note that the document can take a while to get through, so leave yourself enough time to read through it all before the class. The link to the document is as follows: http://lchcautobio.ucsd.edu/polyphonic-autobiography/ Also, please do pass on this invite to students and colleagues who might like to join. Thank you! On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 11:04 PM, Beth Ferholt wrote: > We invite you to participate in a Master Class with Michael Cole on Culture, > Development, and the Social Creation of Social Inequality: A Polyphonic > Autobiography, and, more broadly, the history and legacy of LCHC. > > > > Two members at the lab and different times ?Lois Holzman from the > Rockefeller University days in the 1970s and Beth Ferholt most recently in > the 2000s -- will join Mike in the class. We three are wanting to learn how > people are responding to the document: What resonates, what?s confusing, > what?s relevant to the current day and to the work that we all do, etc. > > > > The 90-minute conversation will take place > > Saturday, May 12, 11:00 ? 12:30 PM EDT. > > > > It will be uploaded to the MCA website and kept there for future use. > > > > If you are interested in registering for this class, please send an email > to lholzman@eastsideinstitute.org and we will send you further > information including the instructions for entering the Zoom conversation. > > > > Do note that the document can take a while to get through, so leave > yourself enough time to read through it all before the class. > > > > The link to the document is as follows: > > http://lchcautobio.ucsd.edu/polyphonic-autobiography/ > > Also, please do pass on this invite to students and colleagues who might > like to join. > > Thank you! > > > > -- > Beth Ferholt > Associate Professor > Department of Early Childhood and Art Education > Brooklyn College, City University of New York > 2900 Bedford Avenue > Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889 > > Email: bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu > Phone: (718) 951-5205 > Fax: (718) 951-4816 > -- Beth Ferholt Associate Professor Department of Early Childhood and Art Education Brooklyn College, City University of New York 2900 Bedford Avenue Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889 Email: bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu Phone: (718) 951-5205 Fax: (718) 951-4816 From annalisa@unm.edu Fri May 4 19:34:25 2018 From: annalisa@unm.edu (Annalisa Aguilar) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 02:34:25 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings Message-ID: Hello Xmcars, Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror neurons working across the species. https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt (and a treat) afterwards!) Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us than we think! They want to belong too! Kind regards, Annalisa From a.j.gil@iped.uio.no Sat May 5 08:22:38 2018 From: a.j.gil@iped.uio.no (Alfredo Jornet Gil) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 15:22:38 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social media! There was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that I thought of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html Alfredo On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar > wrote: Hello Xmcars, Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror neurons working across the species. https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt (and a treat) afterwards!) Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us than we think! They want to belong too! Kind regards, Annalisa From mcole@ucsd.edu Sat May 5 09:51:06 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 09:51:06 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> Message-ID: ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to try it with my dog. There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues of human behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, infants begin to display "social referencing" when they start to engage in behaviors that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over the open drawer where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and then looks back at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his reaction before proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she is unsure of which direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on leash. I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our library does not get the journal. Can you obtain it? mike ? On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil wrote: > That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social media! There > was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that I thought > of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ > WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html > > Alfredo > > On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar isa@unm.edu>> wrote: > > Hello Xmcars, > > > Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror neurons > working across the species. > > > https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 > > > It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. > > > (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt (and a > treat) afterwards!) > > > Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us than we > think! > > > They want to belong too! > > > Kind regards, > > > Annalisa > From hshonerd@gmail.com Sat May 5 10:52:14 2018 From: hshonerd@gmail.com (HENRY SHONERD) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 11:52:14 -0600 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Annalisa, Happy Cinco de Mayo! Here?s where your post has pointed me===> The distinction between humans and other animals is an important one, but I think I?m happier when I think of how we ARE animals too. And maybe we are most human when we play with the distinction, not get to serious about it. And what animal doesn?t play? I?m thinking about a distinction that David K makes====>adults say ?Let?s play a game, children say "let?s play?. (I think I have that right.) I am getting all philosophical about this?which means I?ve begun to do what I often do ===>write something down then replace it with something else?and I never can finish. Enough said. Henry > On May 4, 2018, at 8:34 PM, Annalisa Aguilar wrote: > > Hello Xmcars, > > > Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror neurons working across the species. > > > https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 > > > It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. > > > (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt (and a treat) afterwards!) > > > Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us than we think! > > > They want to belong too! > > > Kind regards, > > > Annalisa From hshonerd@gmail.com Sat May 5 13:53:23 2018 From: hshonerd@gmail.com (HENRY SHONERD) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 14:53:23 -0600 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> Message-ID: A continuacion: So, I?m watching the pre-event narrative for the Kentucky Derby on NBC. My Navajo brother Herb is watching, because his daughter works with thoroughbred horses a few miles down the road from where the broadcast is eminating. ?Boring? was what Herb said about the commentary until a back story that was about thoroughbred horses that were set free during a forest fire in California, rather than be burned to death. Forty-six were unlucky enough to have the doors to their stalls stay shut as the fires came on. Some of the survivors spent days on the run. The story was courage, love and respect. And horses and their owners were back to winning in statistically unexpected ways. Herb didn?t think that story was boring. Henry > On May 5, 2018, at 10:51 AM, mike cole wrote: > > ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to try it with my dog. > > There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues of human > behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, infants begin > to display "social referencing" when they start to engage in behaviors > that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over the open drawer > where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and then looks back > at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his reaction before > proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. > > My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she is unsure of which > direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on leash. > > I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our library does not get the > journal. > Can you obtain it? > > mike > ? > > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil > wrote: > >> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social media! There >> was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that I thought >> of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ >> WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html >> >> Alfredo >> >> On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar > isa@unm.edu>> wrote: >> >> Hello Xmcars, >> >> >> Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror neurons >> working across the species. >> >> >> https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 >> >> >> It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. >> >> >> (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt (and a >> treat) afterwards!) >> >> >> Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us than we >> think! >> >> >> They want to belong too! >> >> >> Kind regards, >> >> >> Annalisa >> From mcole@ucsd.edu Sat May 5 16:14:29 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 16:14:29 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Lev Zasetsky film Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Today I received a note from Tanya Akhutina, a neuropsychologist in Moscow who is a student of Alexander Luria. She sent me a film about Lev Zastesky, who was the subject of Alexander Romanovitch's "man with a shattered world." The film is a little under 8 minutes long. You might find it interesting. The audio is in Russian but there are English subtitles. The subtitles fly by, but so does the verbal Russian (!). mike https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ ByJ/view?usp=sharing From Peg.Griffin@att.net Sat May 5 17:06:18 2018 From: Peg.Griffin@att.net (Peg Griffin) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 20:06:18 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <002401d3e4ce$0fadca40$2f095ec0$@att.net> How exciting. I want very much to see it. But, the link didn't work for me. Here's what it gave me instead: Sorry, the file you have requested does not exist. Make sure that you have the correct URL and the file exists. Get stuff done with Google Drive Apps in Google Drive make it easy to create, store and share online documents, spreadsheets, presentations and more. Learn more at drive.google.com/start/apps. Peg PS Remember the American psychologist who mixed up mind and world? -----Original Message----- From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2018 7:14 PM To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Lev Zasetsky film Dear Colleagues, Today I received a note from Tanya Akhutina, a neuropsychologist in Moscow who is a student of Alexander Luria. She sent me a film about Lev Zastesky, who was the subject of Alexander Romanovitch's "man with a shattered world." The film is a little under 8 minutes long. You might find it interesting. The audio is in Russian but there are English subtitles. The subtitles fly by, but so does the verbal Russian (!). mike https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ ByJ/view?usp=sharing From Peg.Griffin@att.net Sat May 5 17:10:18 2018 From: Peg.Griffin@att.net (Peg Griffin) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 20:10:18 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film In-Reply-To: <002401d3e4ce$0fadca40$2f095ec0$@att.net> References: <002401d3e4ce$0fadca40$2f095ec0$@att.net> Message-ID: <002901d3e4ce$9fc2b550$df481ff0$@att.net> Oops. Never mind I see what happened. The url continues on a new line and the two parts have to be recombined. Thanks, Peg -----Original Message----- From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Peg Griffin Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2018 8:06 PM To: 'eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity' Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film How exciting. I want very much to see it. But, the link didn't work for me. Here's what it gave me instead: Sorry, the file you have requested does not exist. Make sure that you have the correct URL and the file exists. Get stuff done with Google Drive Apps in Google Drive make it easy to create, store and share online documents, spreadsheets, presentations and more. Learn more at drive.google.com/start/apps. Peg PS Remember the American psychologist who mixed up mind and world? -----Original Message----- From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2018 7:14 PM To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Lev Zasetsky film Dear Colleagues, Today I received a note from Tanya Akhutina, a neuropsychologist in Moscow who is a student of Alexander Luria. She sent me a film about Lev Zastesky, who was the subject of Alexander Romanovitch's "man with a shattered world." The film is a little under 8 minutes long. You might find it interesting. The audio is in Russian but there are English subtitles. The subtitles fly by, but so does the verbal Russian (!). mike https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ ByJ/view?usp=sharing From mcole@ucsd.edu Sat May 5 17:17:45 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Sat, 5 May 2018 17:17:45 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film In-Reply-To: <002401d3e4ce$0fadca40$2f095ec0$@att.net> References: <002401d3e4ce$0fadca40$2f095ec0$@att.net> Message-ID: ?Folks The whole address is there but it does not fit on one line in my browser. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ ByJ/view?usp=sharing the Byj/view?usp=sharing is part of the url. Thanks for the error correction mike ? On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 5:08 PM Peg Griffin wrote: > How exciting. I want very much to see it. > But, the link didn't work for me. Here's what it gave me instead: > Sorry, the file you have requested does not exist. > Make sure that you have the correct URL and the file > exists. > Get stuff done with Google Drive > Apps in Google Drive make it easy to create, store and > share online documents, spreadsheets, presentations and more. > Learn more at drive.google.com/start/apps. > Peg > PS Remember the American psychologist who mixed up mind and world? > > -----Original Message----- > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@ > mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole > Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2018 7:14 PM > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > Subject: [Xmca-l] Lev Zasetsky film > > Dear Colleagues, > > Today I received a note from Tanya Akhutina, a neuropsychologist in Moscow > who is a student of Alexander Luria. She sent me a film about Lev Zastesky, > who was the subject of Alexander Romanovitch's "man with a shattered > world." The film is a little under 8 minutes long. You might > find it interesting. > > The audio is in Russian but there are English subtitles. The subtitles fly > by, but so does the verbal Russian (!). > > mike > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ > ByJ/view?usp=sharing > From john.crippsclark@deakin.edu.au Sat May 5 17:47:52 2018 From: john.crippsclark@deakin.edu.au (John Cripps Clark) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 00:47:52 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> Message-ID: <890F0178-9492-4A53-9C8A-F2B8614B451D@deakin.edu.au> A recent episode of Freakonomics is perhaps apposite here: http://freakonomics.com/podcast/animal-economics/ Alexandra Horowitz finishes the show by saying: " I?ve studied and taught animal cognition and comparative psychology for decades. And this question, ?What?s the one thing that distinguishes humans from non-human animals?? is clearly the driving force of much research. We might trace it back to Plato, who described man as a featherless biped. But the smart-alec Diogenes then plucked a chicken and said triumphantly, ?Here is Plato?s man.? To which Plato simply pivoted, adding, ?Okay, a featherless biped with broad nails, not claws.? And so it has been since, trying to find the feature that will verify the human species? uniqueness. ?It?s imitation.? ?It?s culture.? ?It?s teaching.? ?It?s language.? ?It?s a theory of mind.? Each confidently proposed and then collapsing under the weight of actual evidence. The one thing that makes humans human? Our obsession with asking and answering this question. As far as I know we?re the only species so concerned with distinguishing ourselves from other animals. Of course, research could prove me wrong." John ?On 6/5/18, 6:54 am, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of HENRY SHONERD" wrote: A continuacion: So, I?m watching the pre-event narrative for the Kentucky Derby on NBC. My Navajo brother Herb is watching, because his daughter works with thoroughbred horses a few miles down the road from where the broadcast is eminating. ?Boring? was what Herb said about the commentary until a back story that was about thoroughbred horses that were set free during a forest fire in California, rather than be burned to death. Forty-six were unlucky enough to have the doors to their stalls stay shut as the fires came on. Some of the survivors spent days on the run. The story was courage, love and respect. And horses and their owners were back to winning in statistically unexpected ways. Herb didn?t think that story was boring. Henry > On May 5, 2018, at 10:51 AM, mike cole wrote: > > ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to try it with my dog. > > There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues of human > behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, infants begin > to display "social referencing" when they start to engage in behaviors > that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over the open drawer > where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and then looks back > at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his reaction before > proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. > > My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she is unsure of which > direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on leash. > > I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our library does not get the > journal. > Can you obtain it? > > mike > ? > > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil > wrote: > >> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social media! There >> was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that I thought >> of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ >> WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html >> >> Alfredo >> >> On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar > isa@unm.edu>> wrote: >> >> Hello Xmcars, >> >> >> Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror neurons >> working across the species. >> >> >> https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 >> >> >> It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. >> >> >> (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt (and a >> treat) afterwards!) >> >> >> Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us than we >> think! >> >> >> They want to belong too! >> >> >> Kind regards, >> >> >> Annalisa >> Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise the sender by return email or telephone. Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments are error or virus free. From andyb@marxists.org Sat May 5 19:21:38 2018 From: andyb@marxists.org (Andy Blunden) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 12:21:38 +1000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: <890F0178-9492-4A53-9C8A-F2B8614B451D@deakin.edu.au> References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> <890F0178-9492-4A53-9C8A-F2B8614B451D@deakin.edu.au> Message-ID: <9bcc11a8-81f1-e2c9-d181-81ea2073f812@marxists.org> As Vygotsky showed, whatever behaviour "distinguishes" humans from other animals, then that behaviour will be found in rudimentary form in some animals. The point is not to look for an attribute which one has and another doesn't, but the behaviour which generates the transition from non-human animal to human. If that behaviour did not exist in any non-human animals, then you would be looking for God to grant it to humans. Andy ------------------------------------------------------------ Andy Blunden http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm On 6/05/2018 10:47 AM, John Cripps Clark wrote: > A recent episode of Freakonomics is perhaps apposite here: > > http://freakonomics.com/podcast/animal-economics/ > > Alexandra Horowitz finishes the show by saying: > > " I?ve studied and taught animal cognition and comparative psychology for decades. And this question, ?What?s the one thing that distinguishes humans from non-human animals?? is clearly the driving force of much research. We might trace it back to Plato, who described man as a featherless biped. But the smart-alec Diogenes then plucked a chicken and said triumphantly, ?Here is Plato?s man.? To which Plato simply pivoted, adding, ?Okay, a featherless biped with broad nails, not claws.? And so it has been since, trying to find the feature that will verify the human species? uniqueness. ?It?s imitation.? ?It?s culture.? ?It?s teaching.? ?It?s language.? ?It?s a theory of mind.? Each confidently proposed and then collapsing under the weight of actual evidence. > > The one thing that makes humans human? Our obsession with asking and answering this question. As far as I know we?re the only species so concerned with distinguishing ourselves from other animals. Of course, research could prove me wrong." > > John > > ?On 6/5/18, 6:54 am, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of HENRY SHONERD" wrote: > > A continuacion: > So, I?m watching the pre-event narrative for the Kentucky Derby on NBC. My Navajo brother Herb is watching, because his daughter works with thoroughbred horses a few miles down the road from where the broadcast is eminating. ?Boring? was what Herb said about the commentary until a back story that was about thoroughbred horses that were set free during a forest fire in California, rather than be burned to death. Forty-six were unlucky enough to have the doors to their stalls stay shut as the fires came on. Some of the survivors spent days on the run. The story was courage, love and respect. And horses and their owners were back to winning in statistically unexpected ways. Herb didn?t think that story was boring. > Henry > > > > > > > On May 5, 2018, at 10:51 AM, mike cole wrote: > > > > ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to try it with my dog. > > > > There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues of human > > behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, infants begin > > to display "social referencing" when they start to engage in behaviors > > that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over the open drawer > > where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and then looks back > > at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his reaction before > > proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. > > > > My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she is unsure of which > > direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on leash. > > > > I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our library does not get the > > journal. > > Can you obtain it? > > > > mike > > ? > > > > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil > > wrote: > > > >> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social media! There > >> was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that I thought > >> of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ > >> WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html > >> > >> Alfredo > >> > >> On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar >> isa@unm.edu>> wrote: > >> > >> Hello Xmcars, > >> > >> > >> Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror neurons > >> working across the species. > >> > >> > >> https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 > >> > >> > >> It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. > >> > >> > >> (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt (and a > >> treat) afterwards!) > >> > >> > >> Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us than we > >> think! > >> > >> > >> They want to belong too! > >> > >> > >> Kind regards, > >> > >> > >> Annalisa > >> > > > > > > Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise the sender by return email or telephone. > > Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments are error or virus free. > From hhdave15@gmail.com Sat May 5 23:43:57 2018 From: hhdave15@gmail.com (Harshad Dave) Date: Sun, 06 May 2018 06:43:57 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: <9bcc11a8-81f1-e2c9-d181-81ea2073f812@marxists.org> References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> <890F0178-9492-4A53-9C8A-F2B8614B451D@deakin.edu.au> <9bcc11a8-81f1-e2c9-d181-81ea2073f812@marxists.org> Message-ID: "Human is the only animal who fabricated ethics to justify his unethical acts." Harshad. On Sun, 6 May 2018 7:54 AM Andy Blunden, wrote: > As Vygotsky showed, whatever behaviour "distinguishes" > humans from other animals, then that behaviour will be found > in rudimentary form in some animals. The point is not to > look for an attribute which one has and another doesn't, but > the behaviour which generates the transition from non-human > animal to human. If that behaviour did not exist in any > non-human animals, then you would be looking for God to > grant it to humans. > > Andy > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > Andy Blunden > http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm > On 6/05/2018 10:47 AM, John Cripps Clark wrote: > > A recent episode of Freakonomics is perhaps apposite here: > > > > http://freakonomics.com/podcast/animal-economics/ > > > > Alexandra Horowitz finishes the show by saying: > > > > " I?ve studied and taught animal cognition and comparative psychology > for decades. And this question, ?What?s the one thing that distinguishes > humans from non-human animals?? is clearly the driving force of much > research. We might trace it back to Plato, who described man as a > featherless biped. But the smart-alec Diogenes then plucked a chicken and > said triumphantly, ?Here is Plato?s man.? To which Plato simply pivoted, > adding, ?Okay, a featherless biped with broad nails, not claws.? And so it > has been since, trying to find the feature that will verify the human > species? uniqueness. ?It?s imitation.? ?It?s culture.? ?It?s teaching.? > ?It?s language.? ?It?s a theory of mind.? Each confidently proposed and > then collapsing under the weight of actual evidence. > > > > The one thing that makes humans human? Our obsession with asking and > answering this question. As far as I know we?re the only species so > concerned with distinguishing ourselves from other animals. Of course, > research could prove me wrong." > > > > John > > > > ?On 6/5/18, 6:54 am, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of > HENRY SHONERD" hshonerd@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > A continuacion: > > So, I?m watching the pre-event narrative for the Kentucky Derby on > NBC. My Navajo brother Herb is watching, because his daughter works with > thoroughbred horses a few miles down the road from where the broadcast is > eminating. ?Boring? was what Herb said about the commentary until a back > story that was about thoroughbred horses that were set free during a forest > fire in California, rather than be burned to death. Forty-six were unlucky > enough to have the doors to their stalls stay shut as the fires came on. > Some of the survivors spent days on the run. The story was courage, love > and respect. And horses and their owners were back to winning in > statistically unexpected ways. Herb didn?t think that story was boring. > > Henry > > > > > > > > > > > > > On May 5, 2018, at 10:51 AM, mike cole wrote: > > > > > > ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to try it > with my dog. > > > > > > There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues of human > > > behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, infants > begin > > > to display "social referencing" when they start to engage in > behaviors > > > that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over the open > drawer > > > where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and then > looks back > > > at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his reaction > before > > > proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. > > > > > > My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she is unsure > of which > > > direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on leash. > > > > > > I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our library does > not get the > > > journal. > > > Can you obtain it? > > > > > > mike > > > ? > > > > > > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil < > a.j.gil@iped.uio.no> > > > wrote: > > > > > >> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social > media! There > > >> was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that > I thought > > >> of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ > > >> WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html > > >> > > >> Alfredo > > >> > > >> On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar > >> isa@unm.edu>> wrote: > > >> > > >> Hello Xmcars, > > >> > > >> > > >> Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror > neurons > > >> working across the species. > > >> > > >> > > >> https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 > > >> > > >> > > >> It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. > > >> > > >> > > >> (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt > (and a > > >> treat) afterwards!) > > >> > > >> > > >> Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us > than we > > >> think! > > >> > > >> > > >> They want to belong too! > > >> > > >> > > >> Kind regards, > > >> > > >> > > >> Annalisa > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the > named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or > storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this > email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise > the sender by return email or telephone. > > > > Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments > are error or virus free. > > > > From bella.kotik@gmail.com Sun May 6 00:55:41 2018 From: bella.kotik@gmail.com (Bella Kotik-Friedgut) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 10:55:41 +0300 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film In-Reply-To: References: <002401d3e4ce$0fadca40$2f095ec0$@att.net> Message-ID: Based on research about his life for scenario of a full artistic film , this short documentary was presented at the Congress in Yekaterinburg, but hopefully they will continue to a full film. Sincerely yours Bella Kotik-Friedgut On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 3:17 AM, mike cole wrote: > ?Folks > > The whole address is there but it does not fit on one line in my browser. > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ > ByJ/view?usp=sharing > > the Byj/view?usp=sharing is part of the url. > > Thanks for the error correction > mike > ? > > > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 5:08 PM Peg Griffin wrote: > > > How exciting. I want very much to see it. > > But, the link didn't work for me. Here's what it gave me instead: > > Sorry, the file you have requested does not exist. > > Make sure that you have the correct URL and the file > > exists. > > Get stuff done with Google Drive > > Apps in Google Drive make it easy to create, store and > > share online documents, spreadsheets, presentations and more. > > Learn more at drive.google.com/start/apps. > > Peg > > PS Remember the American psychologist who mixed up mind and world? > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@ > > mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole > > Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2018 7:14 PM > > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > > Subject: [Xmca-l] Lev Zasetsky film > > > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > Today I received a note from Tanya Akhutina, a neuropsychologist in > Moscow > > who is a student of Alexander Luria. She sent me a film about Lev > Zastesky, > > who was the subject of Alexander Romanovitch's "man with a shattered > > world." The film is a little under 8 minutes long. You might > > find it interesting. > > > > The audio is in Russian but there are English subtitles. The subtitles > fly > > by, but so does the verbal Russian (!). > > > > mike > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ > > ByJ/view?usp=sharing > > > From robsub@ariadne.org.uk Sun May 6 02:38:06 2018 From: robsub@ariadne.org.uk (robsub@ariadne.org.uk) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 10:38:06 +0100 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> <890F0178-9492-4A53-9C8A-F2B8614B451D@deakin.edu.au> <9bcc11a8-81f1-e2c9-d181-81ea2073f812@marxists.org> Message-ID: It might be fruitful to consider this simultaneously from two angles: what distinguishes us from animals, and what distinguishes us from robots. The robot path focuses around feelings, ethics and decision making, and is as murky as the animal angle. If you have the time and patience, it is worth watching the Swedish Akta Manniskor ("Real Humans"), and its English derivatve Humans. "Humans" is reversioned rather than translated. It keeps the same story but treats it differently in interesting ways, making for thought provoking comparisons about the ways they deal with the issues. Akta manniskor is available via wlext http://wlext.net/series/akta-manniskor-season-1. You have to put up with occasional bandwidth problems on their server, and some extremely dodgy ads. Humans is available via All4 in the UK http://www.channel4.com/programmes/humans. And I am delighted to find that series 3 is about to air. I have set my alarm clock. On 06/05/2018 07:43, Harshad Dave wrote: > "Human is the only animal who fabricated ethics to justify his unethical > acts." > Harshad. > > On Sun, 6 May 2018 7:54 AM Andy Blunden, wrote: > >> As Vygotsky showed, whatever behaviour "distinguishes" >> humans from other animals, then that behaviour will be found >> in rudimentary form in some animals. The point is not to >> look for an attribute which one has and another doesn't, but >> the behaviour which generates the transition from non-human >> animal to human. If that behaviour did not exist in any >> non-human animals, then you would be looking for God to >> grant it to humans. >> >> Andy >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> Andy Blunden >> http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm >> On 6/05/2018 10:47 AM, John Cripps Clark wrote: >>> A recent episode of Freakonomics is perhaps apposite here: >>> >>> http://freakonomics.com/podcast/animal-economics/ >>> >>> Alexandra Horowitz finishes the show by saying: >>> >>> " I?ve studied and taught animal cognition and comparative psychology >> for decades. And this question, ?What?s the one thing that distinguishes >> humans from non-human animals?? is clearly the driving force of much >> research. We might trace it back to Plato, who described man as a >> featherless biped. But the smart-alec Diogenes then plucked a chicken and >> said triumphantly, ?Here is Plato?s man.? To which Plato simply pivoted, >> adding, ?Okay, a featherless biped with broad nails, not claws.? And so it >> has been since, trying to find the feature that will verify the human >> species? uniqueness. ?It?s imitation.? ?It?s culture.? ?It?s teaching.? >> ?It?s language.? ?It?s a theory of mind.? Each confidently proposed and >> then collapsing under the weight of actual evidence. >>> The one thing that makes humans human? Our obsession with asking and >> answering this question. As far as I know we?re the only species so >> concerned with distinguishing ourselves from other animals. Of course, >> research could prove me wrong." >>> John >>> >>> ?On 6/5/18, 6:54 am, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of >> HENRY SHONERD" > hshonerd@gmail.com> wrote: >>> A continuacion: >>> So, I?m watching the pre-event narrative for the Kentucky Derby on >> NBC. My Navajo brother Herb is watching, because his daughter works with >> thoroughbred horses a few miles down the road from where the broadcast is >> eminating. ?Boring? was what Herb said about the commentary until a back >> story that was about thoroughbred horses that were set free during a forest >> fire in California, rather than be burned to death. Forty-six were unlucky >> enough to have the doors to their stalls stay shut as the fires came on. >> Some of the survivors spent days on the run. The story was courage, love >> and respect. And horses and their owners were back to winning in >> statistically unexpected ways. Herb didn?t think that story was boring. >>> Henry >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > On May 5, 2018, at 10:51 AM, mike cole wrote: >>> > >>> > ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to try it >> with my dog. >>> > >>> > There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues of human >>> > behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, infants >> begin >>> > to display "social referencing" when they start to engage in >> behaviors >>> > that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over the open >> drawer >>> > where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and then >> looks back >>> > at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his reaction >> before >>> > proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. >>> > >>> > My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she is unsure >> of which >>> > direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on leash. >>> > >>> > I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our library does >> not get the >>> > journal. >>> > Can you obtain it? >>> > >>> > mike >>> > ? >>> > >>> > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil < >> a.j.gil@iped.uio.no> >>> > wrote: >>> > >>> >> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social >> media! There >>> >> was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that >> I thought >>> >> of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ >>> >> WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html >>> >> >>> >> Alfredo >>> >> >>> >> On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar > >> >> isa@unm.edu>> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> Hello Xmcars, >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror >> neurons >>> >> working across the species. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt >> (and a >>> >> treat) afterwards!) >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us >> than we >>> >> think! >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> They want to belong too! >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Kind regards, >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Annalisa >>> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the >> named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or >> storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this >> email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise >> the sender by return email or telephone. >>> Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments >> are error or virus free. >> From a.j.gil@iped.uio.no Sun May 6 02:49:35 2018 From: a.j.gil@iped.uio.no (Alfredo Jornet Gil) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 09:49:35 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film In-Reply-To: References: <002401d3e4ce$0fadca40$2f095ec0$@att.net> , Message-ID: <1525600161526.7559@iped.uio.no> Here is the link in one line: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ByJ/view?usp=sharing Alfredo Jornet ________________________________ New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full ________________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of Bella Kotik-Friedgut Sent: 06 May 2018 09:55 To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film Based on research about his life for scenario of a full artistic film , this short documentary was presented at the Congress in Yekaterinburg, but hopefully they will continue to a full film. Sincerely yours Bella Kotik-Friedgut On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 3:17 AM, mike cole wrote: > ?Folks > > The whole address is there but it does not fit on one line in my browser. > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ > ByJ/view?usp=sharing > > the Byj/view?usp=sharing is part of the url. > > Thanks for the error correction > mike > ? > > > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 5:08 PM Peg Griffin wrote: > > > How exciting. I want very much to see it. > > But, the link didn't work for me. Here's what it gave me instead: > > Sorry, the file you have requested does not exist. > > Make sure that you have the correct URL and the file > > exists. > > Get stuff done with Google Drive > > Apps in Google Drive make it easy to create, store and > > share online documents, spreadsheets, presentations and more. > > Learn more at drive.google.com/start/apps. > > Peg > > PS Remember the American psychologist who mixed up mind and world? > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@ > > mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole > > Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2018 7:14 PM > > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > > Subject: [Xmca-l] Lev Zasetsky film > > > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > Today I received a note from Tanya Akhutina, a neuropsychologist in > Moscow > > who is a student of Alexander Luria. She sent me a film about Lev > Zastesky, > > who was the subject of Alexander Romanovitch's "man with a shattered > > world." The film is a little under 8 minutes long. You might > > find it interesting. > > > > The audio is in Russian but there are English subtitles. The subtitles > fly > > by, but so does the verbal Russian (!). > > > > mike > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ > > ByJ/view?usp=sharing > > > From john.crippsclark@deakin.edu.au Sun May 6 02:53:40 2018 From: john.crippsclark@deakin.edu.au (John Cripps Clark) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 09:53:40 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> <890F0178-9492-4A53-9C8A-F2B8614B451D@deakin.edu.au> <9bcc11a8-81f1-e2c9-d181-81ea2073f812@marxists.org> Message-ID: <197F7D1F-E5EC-4F94-AF13-87D36317DB81@deakin.edu.au> As David has pointed out, it is pointless to try and manufacture a characteristic that distinguish one particular type of animal (humans) ? la Plato. There are good examples of animals that perpetrate and dissemble "unethical acts". There is an overlap between human and animal characteristics and the behaviours that characterise the transitions. It is interesting to see a similar confusion arising in the debate about distinguishing humans from intelligent machines. John ?On 6/5/18, 7:39 pm, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of robsub@ariadne.org.uk" wrote: It might be fruitful to consider this simultaneously from two angles: what distinguishes us from animals, and what distinguishes us from robots. The robot path focuses around feelings, ethics and decision making, and is as murky as the animal angle. If you have the time and patience, it is worth watching the Swedish Akta Manniskor ("Real Humans"), and its English derivatve Humans. "Humans" is reversioned rather than translated. It keeps the same story but treats it differently in interesting ways, making for thought provoking comparisons about the ways they deal with the issues. Akta manniskor is available via wlext http://wlext.net/series/akta-manniskor-season-1. You have to put up with occasional bandwidth problems on their server, and some extremely dodgy ads. Humans is available via All4 in the UK http://www.channel4.com/programmes/humans. And I am delighted to find that series 3 is about to air. I have set my alarm clock. On 06/05/2018 07:43, Harshad Dave wrote: > "Human is the only animal who fabricated ethics to justify his unethical > acts." > Harshad. > > On Sun, 6 May 2018 7:54 AM Andy Blunden, wrote: > >> As Vygotsky showed, whatever behaviour "distinguishes" >> humans from other animals, then that behaviour will be found >> in rudimentary form in some animals. The point is not to >> look for an attribute which one has and another doesn't, but >> the behaviour which generates the transition from non-human >> animal to human. If that behaviour did not exist in any >> non-human animals, then you would be looking for God to >> grant it to humans. >> >> Andy >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> Andy Blunden >> http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm >> On 6/05/2018 10:47 AM, John Cripps Clark wrote: >>> A recent episode of Freakonomics is perhaps apposite here: >>> >>> http://freakonomics.com/podcast/animal-economics/ >>> >>> Alexandra Horowitz finishes the show by saying: >>> >>> " I?ve studied and taught animal cognition and comparative psychology >> for decades. And this question, ?What?s the one thing that distinguishes >> humans from non-human animals?? is clearly the driving force of much >> research. We might trace it back to Plato, who described man as a >> featherless biped. But the smart-alec Diogenes then plucked a chicken and >> said triumphantly, ?Here is Plato?s man.? To which Plato simply pivoted, >> adding, ?Okay, a featherless biped with broad nails, not claws.? And so it >> has been since, trying to find the feature that will verify the human >> species? uniqueness. ?It?s imitation.? ?It?s culture.? ?It?s teaching.? >> ?It?s language.? ?It?s a theory of mind.? Each confidently proposed and >> then collapsing under the weight of actual evidence. >>> The one thing that makes humans human? Our obsession with asking and >> answering this question. As far as I know we?re the only species so >> concerned with distinguishing ourselves from other animals. Of course, >> research could prove me wrong." >>> John >>> >>> On 6/5/18, 6:54 am, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of >> HENRY SHONERD" > hshonerd@gmail.com> wrote: >>> A continuacion: >>> So, I?m watching the pre-event narrative for the Kentucky Derby on >> NBC. My Navajo brother Herb is watching, because his daughter works with >> thoroughbred horses a few miles down the road from where the broadcast is >> eminating. ?Boring? was what Herb said about the commentary until a back >> story that was about thoroughbred horses that were set free during a forest >> fire in California, rather than be burned to death. Forty-six were unlucky >> enough to have the doors to their stalls stay shut as the fires came on. >> Some of the survivors spent days on the run. The story was courage, love >> and respect. And horses and their owners were back to winning in >> statistically unexpected ways. Herb didn?t think that story was boring. >>> Henry >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > On May 5, 2018, at 10:51 AM, mike cole wrote: >>> > >>> > ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to try it >> with my dog. >>> > >>> > There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues of human >>> > behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, infants >> begin >>> > to display "social referencing" when they start to engage in >> behaviors >>> > that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over the open >> drawer >>> > where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and then >> looks back >>> > at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his reaction >> before >>> > proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. >>> > >>> > My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she is unsure >> of which >>> > direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on leash. >>> > >>> > I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our library does >> not get the >>> > journal. >>> > Can you obtain it? >>> > >>> > mike >>> > ? >>> > >>> > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil < >> a.j.gil@iped.uio.no> >>> > wrote: >>> > >>> >> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social >> media! There >>> >> was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that >> I thought >>> >> of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ >>> >> WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html >>> >> >>> >> Alfredo >>> >> >>> >> On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar > >> >> isa@unm.edu>> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> Hello Xmcars, >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror >> neurons >>> >> working across the species. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt >> (and a >>> >> treat) afterwards!) >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us >> than we >>> >> think! >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> They want to belong too! >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Kind regards, >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Annalisa >>> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the >> named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or >> storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this >> email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise >> the sender by return email or telephone. >>> Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments >> are error or virus free. >> Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise the sender by return email or telephone. Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments are error or virus free. From andyb@marxists.org Sun May 6 03:10:13 2018 From: andyb@marxists.org (Andy Blunden) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 20:10:13 +1000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: <197F7D1F-E5EC-4F94-AF13-87D36317DB81@deakin.edu.au> References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> <890F0178-9492-4A53-9C8A-F2B8614B451D@deakin.edu.au> <9bcc11a8-81f1-e2c9-d181-81ea2073f812@marxists.org> <197F7D1F-E5EC-4F94-AF13-87D36317DB81@deakin.edu.au> Message-ID: We cannot understand species in terms of sorting them into boxes according to attributes. The point is to identify the behaviour which actually *brings about* the *transformation* from one species *to the other*. This form of behaviour (not biological characteristics) is the "essence of humanity." In relation to robots and humans, the equivalent question would be what behaviour would transform a human into a non-human robot. Beats me. Andy ------------------------------------------------------------ Andy Blunden http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm On 6/05/2018 7:53 PM, John Cripps Clark wrote: > As David has pointed out, it is pointless to try and manufacture a characteristic that distinguish one particular type of animal (humans) ? la Plato. There are good examples of animals that perpetrate and dissemble "unethical acts". There is an overlap between human and animal characteristics and the behaviours that characterise the transitions. It is interesting to see a similar confusion arising in the debate about distinguishing humans from intelligent machines. > > John > > ?On 6/5/18, 7:39 pm, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of robsub@ariadne.org.uk" wrote: > > It might be fruitful to consider this simultaneously from two angles: > what distinguishes us from animals, and what distinguishes us from > robots. The robot path focuses around feelings, ethics and decision > making, and is as murky as the animal angle. > > If you have the time and patience, it is worth watching the Swedish Akta > Manniskor ("Real Humans"), and its English derivatve Humans. "Humans" is > reversioned rather than translated. It keeps the same story but treats > it differently in interesting ways, making for thought provoking > comparisons about the ways they deal with the issues. > > Akta manniskor is available via wlext > http://wlext.net/series/akta-manniskor-season-1. You have to put up with > occasional bandwidth problems on their server, and some extremely dodgy ads. > > Humans is available via All4 in the UK > http://www.channel4.com/programmes/humans. And I am delighted to find > that series 3 is about to air. I have set my alarm clock. > > On 06/05/2018 07:43, Harshad Dave wrote: > > "Human is the only animal who fabricated ethics to justify his unethical > > acts." > > Harshad. > > > > On Sun, 6 May 2018 7:54 AM Andy Blunden, wrote: > > > >> As Vygotsky showed, whatever behaviour "distinguishes" > >> humans from other animals, then that behaviour will be found > >> in rudimentary form in some animals. The point is not to > >> look for an attribute which one has and another doesn't, but > >> the behaviour which generates the transition from non-human > >> animal to human. If that behaviour did not exist in any > >> non-human animals, then you would be looking for God to > >> grant it to humans. > >> > >> Andy > >> > >> ------------------------------------------------------------ > >> Andy Blunden > >> http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm > >> On 6/05/2018 10:47 AM, John Cripps Clark wrote: > >>> A recent episode of Freakonomics is perhaps apposite here: > >>> > >>> http://freakonomics.com/podcast/animal-economics/ > >>> > >>> Alexandra Horowitz finishes the show by saying: > >>> > >>> " I?ve studied and taught animal cognition and comparative psychology > >> for decades. And this question, ?What?s the one thing that distinguishes > >> humans from non-human animals?? is clearly the driving force of much > >> research. We might trace it back to Plato, who described man as a > >> featherless biped. But the smart-alec Diogenes then plucked a chicken and > >> said triumphantly, ?Here is Plato?s man.? To which Plato simply pivoted, > >> adding, ?Okay, a featherless biped with broad nails, not claws.? And so it > >> has been since, trying to find the feature that will verify the human > >> species? uniqueness. ?It?s imitation.? ?It?s culture.? ?It?s teaching.? > >> ?It?s language.? ?It?s a theory of mind.? Each confidently proposed and > >> then collapsing under the weight of actual evidence. > >>> The one thing that makes humans human? Our obsession with asking and > >> answering this question. As far as I know we?re the only species so > >> concerned with distinguishing ourselves from other animals. Of course, > >> research could prove me wrong." > >>> John > >>> > >>> On 6/5/18, 6:54 am, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of > >> HENRY SHONERD" >> hshonerd@gmail.com> wrote: > >>> A continuacion: > >>> So, I?m watching the pre-event narrative for the Kentucky Derby on > >> NBC. My Navajo brother Herb is watching, because his daughter works with > >> thoroughbred horses a few miles down the road from where the broadcast is > >> eminating. ?Boring? was what Herb said about the commentary until a back > >> story that was about thoroughbred horses that were set free during a forest > >> fire in California, rather than be burned to death. Forty-six were unlucky > >> enough to have the doors to their stalls stay shut as the fires came on. > >> Some of the survivors spent days on the run. The story was courage, love > >> and respect. And horses and their owners were back to winning in > >> statistically unexpected ways. Herb didn?t think that story was boring. > >>> Henry > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > On May 5, 2018, at 10:51 AM, mike cole wrote: > >>> > > >>> > ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to try it > >> with my dog. > >>> > > >>> > There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues of human > >>> > behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, infants > >> begin > >>> > to display "social referencing" when they start to engage in > >> behaviors > >>> > that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over the open > >> drawer > >>> > where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and then > >> looks back > >>> > at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his reaction > >> before > >>> > proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. > >>> > > >>> > My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she is unsure > >> of which > >>> > direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on leash. > >>> > > >>> > I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our library does > >> not get the > >>> > journal. > >>> > Can you obtain it? > >>> > > >>> > mike > >>> > ? > >>> > > >>> > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil < > >> a.j.gil@iped.uio.no> > >>> > wrote: > >>> > > >>> >> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in social > >> media! There > >>> >> was this overview article on comparative cultural cognition that > >> I thought > >>> >> of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ > >>> >> WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html > >>> >> > >>> >> Alfredo > >>> >> > >>> >> On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar >> >>> >> isa@unm.edu>> wrote: > >>> >> > >>> >> Hello Xmcars, > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider mirror > >> neurons > >>> >> working across the species. > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/992062861735219201 > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to something. > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a prompt > >> (and a > >>> >> treat) afterwards!) > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> Still, something to consider why animals might be more like us > >> than we > >>> >> think! > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> They want to belong too! > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> Kind regards, > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> Annalisa > >>> >> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the > >> named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or > >> storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this > >> email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise > >> the sender by return email or telephone. > >>> Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments > >> are error or virus free. > >> > > > > > > Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise the sender by return email or telephone. > > Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments are error or virus free. > From kplakits@gmail.com Sun May 6 03:18:19 2018 From: kplakits@gmail.com (Katerina Plakitsi) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 13:18:19 +0300 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film In-Reply-To: <1525600161526.7559@iped.uio.no> References: <002401d3e4ce$0fadca40$2f095ec0$@att.net> <1525600161526.7559@iped.uio.no> Message-ID: Thank you so much! Katerina Plakitsi *ISCAR President* *Professor of Science Education* *Head of the Dept. of E**arly Childhood Education* *School of Education * *University of Ioannina, Greece* *tel. +302651005771* *fax. +302651005842* *mobile.phone +306972898463* *Skype name: katerina.plakitsi3* https://www.iscar.org/ http://users.uoi.gr/kplakits www.epoque-project.eu http://bdfprojects.wixsite.com/mindset http://www.lib.uoi.gr/serp https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isZAbefnRmo&t=7s 2018-05-06 12:49 GMT+03:00 Alfredo Jornet Gil : > Here is the link in one line: > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ > ByJ/view?usp=sharing > > Alfredo Jornet > ________________________________ > New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, > "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print > available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full > > > ________________________________________ > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu > on behalf of Bella Kotik-Friedgut > Sent: 06 May 2018 09:55 > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Lev Zasetsky film > > Based on research about his life for scenario of a full artistic film , > this short documentary was presented at the Congress in Yekaterinburg, but > hopefully they will continue to a full film. > > Sincerely yours Bella Kotik-Friedgut > > On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 3:17 AM, mike cole wrote: > > > ?Folks > > > > The whole address is there but it does not fit on one line in my browser. > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ > > ByJ/view?usp=sharing > > > > the Byj/view?usp=sharing is part of the url. > > > > Thanks for the error correction > > mike > > ? > > > > > > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 5:08 PM Peg Griffin wrote: > > > > > How exciting. I want very much to see it. > > > But, the link didn't work for me. Here's what it gave me instead: > > > Sorry, the file you have requested does not exist. > > > Make sure that you have the correct URL and the file > > > exists. > > > Get stuff done with Google Drive > > > Apps in Google Drive make it easy to create, store and > > > share online documents, spreadsheets, presentations and more. > > > Learn more at drive.google.com/start/apps. > > > Peg > > > PS Remember the American psychologist who mixed up mind and world? > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@ > > > mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole > > > Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2018 7:14 PM > > > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > > > Subject: [Xmca-l] Lev Zasetsky film > > > > > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > > > Today I received a note from Tanya Akhutina, a neuropsychologist in > > Moscow > > > who is a student of Alexander Luria. She sent me a film about Lev > > Zastesky, > > > who was the subject of Alexander Romanovitch's "man with a shattered > > > world." The film is a little under 8 minutes long. You might > > > find it interesting. > > > > > > The audio is in Russian but there are English subtitles. The subtitles > > fly > > > by, but so does the verbal Russian (!). > > > > > > mike > > > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SHZpyE3TTp6QgGN2ff2OQ6pNh7F4_ > > > ByJ/view?usp=sharing > > > > > > > From hhdave15@gmail.com Sun May 6 04:37:52 2018 From: hhdave15@gmail.com (Harshad Dave) Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 17:07:52 +0530 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: [Xmca -l] sociocultural theory of sentient beings In-Reply-To: References: <8571078F-EBD3-46CE-9931-0667F232EC49@iped.uio.no> <890F0178-9492-4A53-9C8A-F2B8614B451D@deakin.edu.au> <9bcc11a8-81f1-e2c9-d181-81ea2073f812@marxists.org> <197F7D1F-E5EC-4F94-AF13-87D36317DB81@deakin.edu.au> Message-ID: Hi, When there are many vital differences in two things where majority of them are easier to comprehend empirically, it sometime becomes difficult to explain the same in words. It does not mean it is impossible but there might be more arguments than the explanation. The difference between human and animal is the debate of same nature. However, I point out one difference here. Human is the only animal who supplemented his natural abilities with the help of discoveries and inventions made by him to such an extent that it surpassed the evolutionary development in human ability with a revolutionary development in it. He undermined natural abilities of other creatures with his boosted ability substantially in a way that many of them lost the ground in the struggle and conflict resulting into their (creatures) extinction. Other all the creatures of earth, with any reasons, could not develop their ability beyond evolutionary changes. Harshad Dave Harshad Dave Mobile: +91 9979853305 Address: "SWAYAM", B - 116, Yoginagar Township, Opp. Ramakaka Temple, Chhani - 391 740. Vadodara, Gujarat, India. On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 3:40 PM, Andy Blunden wrote: > We cannot understand species in terms of sorting them into > boxes according to attributes. The point is to identify the > behaviour which actually *brings about* the > *transformation* from one species *to the other*. This form > of behaviour (not biological characteristics) is the > "essence of humanity." > > In relation to robots and humans, the equivalent question > would be what behaviour would transform a human into a > non-human robot. > Beats me. > > Andy > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > Andy Blunden > http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm > On 6/05/2018 7:53 PM, John Cripps Clark wrote: > > As David has pointed out, it is pointless to try and manufacture a > characteristic that distinguish one particular type of animal (humans) ? la > Plato. There are good examples of animals that perpetrate and dissemble > "unethical acts". There is an overlap between human and animal > characteristics and the behaviours that characterise the transitions. It is > interesting to see a similar confusion arising in the debate about > distinguishing humans from intelligent machines. > > > > John > > > > ?On 6/5/18, 7:39 pm, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of > robsub@ariadne.org.uk" robsub@ariadne.org.uk> wrote: > > > > It might be fruitful to consider this simultaneously from two angles: > > what distinguishes us from animals, and what distinguishes us from > > robots. The robot path focuses around feelings, ethics and decision > > making, and is as murky as the animal angle. > > > > If you have the time and patience, it is worth watching the Swedish > Akta > > Manniskor ("Real Humans"), and its English derivatve Humans. > "Humans" is > > reversioned rather than translated. It keeps the same story but > treats > > it differently in interesting ways, making for thought provoking > > comparisons about the ways they deal with the issues. > > > > Akta manniskor is available via wlext > > http://wlext.net/series/akta-manniskor-season-1. You have to put up > with > > occasional bandwidth problems on their server, and some extremely > dodgy ads. > > > > Humans is available via All4 in the UK > > http://www.channel4.com/programmes/humans. And I am delighted to > find > > that series 3 is about to air. I have set my alarm clock. > > > > On 06/05/2018 07:43, Harshad Dave wrote: > > > "Human is the only animal who fabricated ethics to justify his > unethical > > > acts." > > > Harshad. > > > > > > On Sun, 6 May 2018 7:54 AM Andy Blunden, > wrote: > > > > > >> As Vygotsky showed, whatever behaviour "distinguishes" > > >> humans from other animals, then that behaviour will be found > > >> in rudimentary form in some animals. The point is not to > > >> look for an attribute which one has and another doesn't, but > > >> the behaviour which generates the transition from non-human > > >> animal to human. If that behaviour did not exist in any > > >> non-human animals, then you would be looking for God to > > >> grant it to humans. > > >> > > >> Andy > > >> > > >> ------------------------------------------------------------ > > >> Andy Blunden > > >> http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm > > >> On 6/05/2018 10:47 AM, John Cripps Clark wrote: > > >>> A recent episode of Freakonomics is perhaps apposite here: > > >>> > > >>> http://freakonomics.com/podcast/animal-economics/ > > >>> > > >>> Alexandra Horowitz finishes the show by saying: > > >>> > > >>> " I?ve studied and taught animal cognition and comparative > psychology > > >> for decades. And this question, ?What?s the one thing that > distinguishes > > >> humans from non-human animals?? is clearly the driving force of > much > > >> research. We might trace it back to Plato, who described man as a > > >> featherless biped. But the smart-alec Diogenes then plucked a > chicken and > > >> said triumphantly, ?Here is Plato?s man.? To which Plato simply > pivoted, > > >> adding, ?Okay, a featherless biped with broad nails, not claws.? > And so it > > >> has been since, trying to find the feature that will verify the > human > > >> species? uniqueness. ?It?s imitation.? ?It?s culture.? ?It?s > teaching.? > > >> ?It?s language.? ?It?s a theory of mind.? Each confidently > proposed and > > >> then collapsing under the weight of actual evidence. > > >>> The one thing that makes humans human? Our obsession with asking > and > > >> answering this question. As far as I know we?re the only species > so > > >> concerned with distinguishing ourselves from other animals. Of > course, > > >> research could prove me wrong." > > >>> John > > >>> > > >>> On 6/5/18, 6:54 am, "xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf > of > > >> HENRY SHONERD" > >> hshonerd@gmail.com> wrote: > > >>> A continuacion: > > >>> So, I?m watching the pre-event narrative for the Kentucky > Derby on > > >> NBC. My Navajo brother Herb is watching, because his daughter > works with > > >> thoroughbred horses a few miles down the road from where the > broadcast is > > >> eminating. ?Boring? was what Herb said about the commentary > until a back > > >> story that was about thoroughbred horses that were set free > during a forest > > >> fire in California, rather than be burned to death. Forty-six > were unlucky > > >> enough to have the doors to their stalls stay shut as the fires > came on. > > >> Some of the survivors spent days on the run. The story was > courage, love > > >> and respect. And horses and their owners were back to winning in > > >> statistically unexpected ways. Herb didn?t think that story was > boring. > > >>> Henry > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > On May 5, 2018, at 10:51 AM, mike cole > wrote: > > >>> > > > >>> > ?That video is thought provoking, Annalisa. I'll have to > try it > > >> with my dog. > > >>> > > > >>> > There are other dog behaviors that seem to be analogues > of human > > >>> > behaviors. For example, in humans, around 9-10 months, > infants > > >> begin > > >>> > to display "social referencing" when they start to engage > in > > >> behaviors > > >>> > that they are uncertain about (a little kids crawls over > the open > > >> drawer > > >>> > where kitchen ware is stored, starts to grab a dish and > then > > >> looks back > > >>> > at her father sitting on a chair behind her to check his > reaction > > >> before > > >>> > proceeding to pick up the dish or leave it where it is. > > >>> > > > >>> > My dog does the same thing when we go for a walk and she > is unsure > > >> of which > > >>> > direction we are going to take, but she is in the lead on > leash. > > >>> > > > >>> > I do not see how to get that article, Alfredo. Our > library does > > >> not get the > > >>> > journal. > > >>> > Can you obtain it? > > >>> > > > >>> > mike > > >>> > ? > > >>> > > > >>> > On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 8:22 AM, Alfredo Jornet Gil < > > >> a.j.gil@iped.uio.no> > > >>> > wrote: > > >>> > > > >>> >> That?s an intellectual twist to cute cats/dogs vids in > social > > >> media! There > > >>> >> was this overview article on comparative cultural > cognition that > > >> I thought > > >>> >> of; I think it?s open access: http://wires.wiley.com/ > > >>> >> WileyCDA/WiresArticle/wisId-WCS14.html > > >>> >> > > >>> >> Alfredo > > >>> >> > > >>> >> On 5 May 2018, at 04:35, Annalisa Aguilar < > annalisa@unm.edu > > >> > >>> >> isa@unm.edu>> wrote: > > >>> >> > > >>> >> Hello Xmcars, > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> Saw this on twitter and I couldn't help but consider > mirror > > >> neurons > > >>> >> working across the species. > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> https://twitter.com/AMAZlNGNATURE/status/ > 992062861735219201 > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> It's not exactly pointing, but it seems to point to > something. > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> (Then again, we can't hear the sound, so there may be a > prompt > > >> (and a > > >>> >> treat) afterwards!) > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> Still, something to consider why animals might be more > like us > > >> than we > > >>> >> think! > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> They want to belong too! > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> Kind regards, > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> Annalisa > > >>> >> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely > for the > > >> named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, > reproduction or > > >> storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have > received this > > >> email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately > and advise > > >> the sender by return email or telephone. > > >>> Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any > attachments > > >> are error or virus free. > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the > named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or > storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this > email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise > the sender by return email or telephone. > > > > Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments > are error or virus free. > > > > From mcole@ucsd.edu Fri May 11 20:09:41 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Fri, 11 May 2018 20:09:41 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Fwd: NPR series on cross-cultural parenting In-Reply-To: <48A75B7C-AD65-4865-BC25-E7FE25E2BE7F@gmail.com> References: <48A75B7C-AD65-4865-BC25-E7FE25E2BE7F@gmail.com> Message-ID: This should be of wide interest. FYI Mike ---------- Forwarded message --------- From: Suzanne Gaskins Date: Fri, May 11, 2018 at 7:00 PM Subject: NPR series on cross-cultural parenting To: Dear friends, family, and colleagues, As some of you know, in early April I hosted a National Public Radio reporter in the village in Yucatan, Mexico where I do my research on Maya children and their families. She and some of her colleagues are putting together a series on parenting in other cultures. In honor of Mother?s Day, the series kicks off this Sunday with an introduction of the theme, and will be followed by a number of stories from around the world, one each week, about particular topics in parenting and children. The series will be aired both on Morning Edition and All Things Considered. Two of those stories will be done by the reporter that I hosted, Michaeleen Doucleff, based on what she learned from visiting a few families in the village. One family from the village will also be discussed in the report introducing the series this Sunday. For each segment, there will be more information posted on the national NPR website, including an essay and some pictures. Here is a link for the website essay paired with this Sunday?s segment: https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2018/05/11/603315432/the-best-mothers-day-gift-get-mom-out-of-the-box . There is a link there where you can sign up for a weekly email about NPR?s health reporting, including the stories in this series. This series is a wonderful opportunity for me and others who work on cultural influences on children?s development and families?including many of you?to have their work and their interests represented to the general public. I?m very excited to hear the whole series. Best, Suzanne -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot From smago@uga.edu Sun May 13 12:48:25 2018 From: smago@uga.edu (Peter Smagorinsky) Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 19:48:25 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] theoretical roots Message-ID: One of our doctoral students sent this to me. It's an effort to locate Geertz theoretically, a sort of archeological essay tracing his influences back into their philosophical roots. I haven't read it yet, so can't personally vouch for it, but it got me thinking. Are there article-length efforts at locating influential people and their influences/sources/antecedents? Especially, are there accessible essays that say, Theorist X came into being as a consequence of these antecedents, here they are and what they proposed, and here's how their influence is realized in Theorist X's research? I know that people like Rene van der Veer (copied here) have done archeological work on a variety of sources of Russian psychology, although I don't know of anything meeting the terms I've just described. What I'm looking for is a set of essays that would help a new doctoral student get a basic grasp of the theoretical landscape from a set of readings, with specific theorists the subject of single, introductory and thus accessible essays. If you've got any such thing for any specific theorists, please share. I think a lot of doc students would benefit from the collection. https://www.academia.edu/22450948/Philosophical_Hermeneutical_Implications_in_Geertz_s_Anthropology [http://a.academia-assets.com/images/open-graph-icons/fb-paper.gif] Philosophical Hermeneutical Implications in Geertz's Anthropology www.academia.edu Reflecting on the recent loss of us all, this essay deals with the theory of the just passed away enthusiastic American anthropologist, Clifford Geertz. The focus will be on the implicit or explicit connection with philosophical hermeneutical Dobos, A. (2007). Philosophical Hermeneutical Implications in Geertz ' s Anthropology. Antropolis, 124-134. From mpacker@cantab.net Sun May 13 13:25:53 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 15:25:53 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: theoretical roots In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <240FCDC5-F995-4FA0-83FD-10E0B7AD5621@cantab.net> Peter, I try to provide this sort of locating in my book The Science of Qualitative Research. As an example I?ve attached chapter 8, in which I try to show how Husserl, Heidegger, Merleau-Ponty, Garfinkel, and Bruno Latour had similar concerns. (In another chapter I consider Geertz, and propose that his view of hermeneutics came from Dilthey rather than Heidegger, something which got him into problems.) Martin > On May 13, 2018, at 2:48 PM, Peter Smagorinsky wrote: > > One of our doctoral students sent this to me. It's an effort to locate Geertz theoretically, a sort of archeological essay tracing his influences back into their philosophical roots. I haven't read it yet, so can't personally vouch for it, but it got me thinking. > > Are there article-length efforts at locating influential people and their influences/sources/antecedents? Especially, are there accessible essays that say, Theorist X came into being as a consequence of these antecedents, here they are and what they proposed, and here's how their influence is realized in Theorist X's research? I know that people like Rene van der Veer (copied here) have done archeological work on a variety of sources of Russian psychology, although I don't know of anything meeting the terms I've just described. What I'm looking for is a set of essays that would help a new doctoral student get a basic grasp of the theoretical landscape from a set of readings, with specific theorists the subject of single, introductory and thus accessible essays. If you've got any such thing for any specific theorists, please share. I think a lot of doc students would benefit from the collection. > > https://www.academia.edu/22450948/Philosophical_Hermeneutical_Implications_in_Geertz_s_Anthropology > [http://a.academia-assets.com/images/open-graph-icons/fb-paper.gif] > > Philosophical Hermeneutical Implications in Geertz's Anthropology > www.academia.edu > Reflecting on the recent loss of us all, this essay deals with the theory of the just passed away enthusiastic American anthropologist, Clifford Geertz. The focus will be on the implicit or explicit connection with philosophical hermeneutical > > > > Dobos, A. (2007). Philosophical Hermeneutical Implications in Geertz ' s Anthropology. Antropolis, 124-134. From annalisa@unm.edu Mon May 14 08:36:42 2018 From: annalisa@unm.edu (Annalisa Aguilar) Date: Mon, 14 May 2018 15:36:42 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Just learned about Patreon Message-ID: Hello Xmcars, Was reading the Guardian here: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/may/14/patreon-rise-jordan-peterson-online-membership and thought this might be of interest to scholars today and future. See: https://www.patreon.com/search?q=research https://www.patreon.com/search?q=academic%20research Not that I want to toot his horn but according to the Guardian Jordan Peterson makes $80K from this platform and is a way for his supporters to fund him. Might be a way to fund Marxists.org? labor studies? academic publishing? Kind regards, Annalisa From Peg.Griffin@att.net Mon May 14 14:55:23 2018 From: Peg.Griffin@att.net (Peg Griffin) Date: Mon, 14 May 2018 17:55:23 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Fwd: NPR series on cross-cultural parenting In-Reply-To: References: <48A75B7C-AD65-4865-BC25-E7FE25E2BE7F@gmail.com> Message-ID: <014701d3ebce$42f37c40$c8da74c0$@att.net> Thanks! -----Original Message----- From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of mike cole Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 11:10 PM To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Fwd: NPR series on cross-cultural parenting This should be of wide interest. FYI Mike ---------- Forwarded message --------- From: Suzanne Gaskins Date: Fri, May 11, 2018 at 7:00 PM Subject: NPR series on cross-cultural parenting To: Dear friends, family, and colleagues, As some of you know, in early April I hosted a National Public Radio reporter in the village in Yucatan, Mexico where I do my research on Maya children and their families. She and some of her colleagues are putting together a series on parenting in other cultures. In honor of Mother?s Day, the series kicks off this Sunday with an introduction of the theme, and will be followed by a number of stories from around the world, one each week, about particular topics in parenting and children. The series will be aired both on Morning Edition and All Things Considered. Two of those stories will be done by the reporter that I hosted, Michaeleen Doucleff, based on what she learned from visiting a few families in the village. One family from the village will also be discussed in the report introducing the series this Sunday. For each segment, there will be more information posted on the national NPR website, including an essay and some pictures. Here is a link for the website essay paired with this Sunday?s segment: https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2018/05/11/603315432/the-best-mothers-day-gift-get-mom-out-of-the-box . There is a link there where you can sign up for a weekly email about NPR?s health reporting, including the stories in this series. This series is a wonderful opportunity for me and others who work on cultural influences on children?s development and families?including many of you?to have their work and their interests represented to the general public. I?m very excited to hear the whole series. Best, Suzanne -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot From mpacker@cantab.net Tue May 15 06:32:38 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 08:32:38 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: theoretical roots In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Peter, I try to provide this sort of locating in my book The Science of Qualitative Research. As an example I?ve attached chapter 8, in which I try to show how Husserl, Heidegger, Merleau-Ponty, Garfinkel, and Bruno Latour had similar concerns. (In another chapter I consider Geertz, and propose that his view of hermeneutics came from Dilthey rather than Heidegger, something which got him into problems.) Martin > On May 13, 2018, at 2:48 PM, Peter Smagorinsky > wrote: > > One of our doctoral students sent this to me. It's an effort to locate Geertz theoretically, a sort of archeological essay tracing his influences back into their philosophical roots. I haven't read it yet, so can't personally vouch for it, but it got me thinking. > > Are there article-length efforts at locating influential people and their influences/sources/antecedents? Especially, are there accessible essays that say, Theorist X came into being as a consequence of these antecedents, here they are and what they proposed, and here's how their influence is realized in Theorist X's research? I know that people like Rene van der Veer (copied here) have done archeological work on a variety of sources of Russian psychology, although I don't know of anything meeting the terms I've just described. What I'm looking for is a set of essays that would help a new doctoral student get a basic grasp of the theoretical landscape from a set of readings, with specific theorists the subject of single, introductory and thus accessible essays. If you've got any such thing for any specific theorists, please share. I think a lot of doc students would benefit from the collection. > > https://www.academia.edu/22450948/Philosophical_Hermeneutical_Implications_in_Geertz_s_Anthropology > [http://a.academia-assets.com/images/open-graph-icons/fb-paper.gif] > > Philosophical Hermeneutical Implications in Geertz's Anthropology > www.academia.edu > Reflecting on the recent loss of us all, this essay deals with the theory of the just passed away enthusiastic American anthropologist, Clifford Geertz. The focus will be on the implicit or explicit connection with philosophical hermeneutical > > > > Dobos, A. (2007). Philosophical Hermeneutical Implications in Geertz ' s Anthropology. Antropolis, 124-134. From mpacker@cantab.net Tue May 15 06:42:56 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 08:42:56 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: theoretical roots In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <02C5B4A8-E5B3-44B6-901E-382B755B3766@cantab.net> That was a test, to try to figure out, with Bruce?s help, why the xmca mail server is removing all my attachments! Martin === Peter, I try to provide this sort of locating in my book The Science of Qualitative Research. As an example I?ve attached chapter 8, in which I try to show how Husserl, Heidegger, Merleau-Ponty, Garfinkel, and Bruno Latour had similar concerns. (In another chapter I consider Geertz, and propose that his view of hermeneutics came from Dilthey rather than Heidegger, something which got him into problems.) Martin > On May 13, 2018, at 2:48 PM, Peter Smagorinsky > wrote: > > One of our doctoral students sent this to me. It's an effort to locate Geertz theoretically, a sort of archeological essay tracing his influences back into their philosophical roots. I haven't read it yet, so can't personally vouch for it, but it got me thinking. > > Are there article-length efforts at locating influential people and their influences/sources/antecedents? Especially, are there accessible essays that say, Theorist X came into being as a consequence of these antecedents, here they are and what they proposed, and here's how their influence is realized in Theorist X's research? I know that people like Rene van der Veer (copied here) have done archeological work on a variety of sources of Russian psychology, although I don't know of anything meeting the terms I've just described. What I'm looking for is a set of essays that would help a new doctoral student get a basic grasp of the theoretical landscape from a set of readings, with specific theorists the subject of single, introductory and thus accessible essays. If you've got any such thing for any specific theorists, please share. I think a lot of doc students would benefit from the collection. > > https://www.academia.edu/22450948/Philosophical_Hermeneutical_Implications_in_Geertz_s_Anthropology > [http://a.academia-assets.com/images/open-graph-icons/fb-paper.gif] > > Philosophical Hermeneutical Implications in Geertz's Anthropology > www.academia.edu > Reflecting on the recent loss of us all, this essay deals with the theory of the just passed away enthusiastic American anthropologist, Clifford Geertz. The focus will be on the implicit or explicit connection with philosophical hermeneutical > > > > Dobos, A. (2007). Philosophical Hermeneutical Implications in Geertz ' s Anthropology. Antropolis, 124-134. From mpacker@cantab.net Tue May 15 07:31:11 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 09:31:11 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: theoretical roots In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Third time is a charm? === Peter, I try to provide this sort of locating in my book The Science of Qualitative Research. As an example I?ve attached chapter 8, in which I try to show how Husserl, Heidegger, Merleau-Ponty, Garfinkel, and Bruno Latour had similar concerns. (In another chapter I consider Geertz, and propose that his view of hermeneutics came from Dilthey rather than Heidegger, something which got him into problems.) Martin From robsub@ariadne.org.uk Tue May 15 08:47:02 2018 From: robsub@ariadne.org.uk (robsub@ariadne.org.uk) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 16:47:02 +0100 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: theoretical roots In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: It clearly doesn't like you :-) Rob On 15/05/2018 15:31, Martin Packer wrote: > Third time is a charm? > === > Peter, I try to provide this sort of locating in my book The Science of Qualitative Research. As an example I?ve attached chapter 8, in which I try to show how Husserl, Heidegger, Merleau-Ponty, Garfinkel, and Bruno Latour had similar concerns. (In another chapter I consider Geertz, and propose that his view of hermeneutics came from Dilthey rather than Heidegger, something which got him into problems.) > > Martin > > > > From mpacker@cantab.net Tue May 15 09:21:39 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 11:21:39 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: theoretical roots In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <78A2BBD0-D80B-49A7-BE8C-3285962C0DB2@cantab.net> Evidently not! It has, however, stopped sending me ominous notifications informing me that I sending messages from a dangerous part of the world! Like there?s another kind of part? Martin > On May 15, 2018, at 10:47 AM, robsub@ariadne.org.uk wrote: > > It clearly doesn't like you :-) > > Rob > > On 15/05/2018 15:31, Martin Packer wrote: >> Third time is a charm? >> === >> Peter, I try to provide this sort of locating in my book The Science of Qualitative Research. As an example I?ve attached chapter 8, in which I try to show how Husserl, Heidegger, Merleau-Ponty, Garfinkel, and Bruno Latour had similar concerns. (In another chapter I consider Geertz, and propose that his view of hermeneutics came from Dilthey rather than Heidegger, something which got him into problems.) >> >> Martin >> >> >> >> > > From mcole@ucsd.edu Tue May 15 09:21:33 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 09:21:33 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Martin Chapter 8 Message-ID: Martin is unable to get his attachments through to xmca. I am forwarding chapter 8 sent initially in response to Peter S's inquiry about the sources of ideas. mike -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: SQR_Packer_ch8.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 912855 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180515/317ca007/attachment-0001.pdf From mcole@ucsd.edu Tue May 15 10:39:39 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 10:39:39 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: theoretical roots In-Reply-To: <78A2BBD0-D80B-49A7-BE8C-3285962C0DB2@cantab.net> References: <78A2BBD0-D80B-49A7-BE8C-3285962C0DB2@cantab.net> Message-ID: So much for net neutrality, Martin The foxes rule the chicken coop mike On Tue, May 15, 2018 at 9:21 AM, Martin Packer wrote: > Evidently not! It has, however, stopped sending me ominous notifications > informing me that I sending messages from a dangerous part of the world! > Like there?s another kind of part? > > Martin > > > On May 15, 2018, at 10:47 AM, robsub@ariadne.org.uk wrote: > > > > It clearly doesn't like you :-) > > > > Rob > > > > On 15/05/2018 15:31, Martin Packer wrote: > >> Third time is a charm? > >> === > >> Peter, I try to provide this sort of locating in my book The Science of > Qualitative Research. As an example I?ve attached chapter 8, in which I try > to show how Husserl, Heidegger, Merleau-Ponty, Garfinkel, and Bruno Latour > had similar concerns. (In another chapter I consider Geertz, and propose > that his view of hermeneutics came from Dilthey rather than Heidegger, > something which got him into problems.) > >> > >> Martin > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot From mcole@ucsd.edu Tue May 15 10:50:05 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 10:50:05 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Chuck Goodwin - RIP Message-ID: A valued colleague and friend from whom many of us learned a lot and are still learning. mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Charles Goodwin May 7, 2018 *Charles (Chuck) Goodwin* died on March 31, 2018, in Los Angeles, the city where he was born on October 9, 1943, and where he returned in 1996 when he was hired at the University of California, Los Angeles, in the Department of Applied Linguistics. In 2017 he retired as Distinguished Professor of Communication. >From an early age Goodwin showed an aptitude and passion for photography, a medium that he later combined with video and computer technology to capture and represent the unfolding semiotics of talk, gestures, and tool-use. After graduating from Holy Cross, where he studied English literature, and a year spent at the New York University School of Law, Goodwin went to the Annenberg School of Communication at the University of Pennsylvania. There, he was exposed to cybernetics by his advisor, Klaus Krippendorff, and to the study of face-to-face communication through his job as a research associate and filmmaker in the Philadelphia Child Guidance Clinic where Gregory Bateson?s ?systems theory? was being applied to family therapy. During this time Goodwin also met his future wife Marjorie (Candy) Harness, whose advisor was Erving Goffman, and he began to attend the latter?s courses, which were also attended by Gail Jefferson and William Labov. In 1976, Chuck and Candy Goodwin joined the department of anthropology at the University of South Carolina. Candy was completing her dissertation on Black children?s verbal virtuosity and argumentation, which debunked popular stereotypes of the difference between boys and girls? speaking styles. The turn-by-turn analysis made possible by her data played a crucial role in the Goodwins embracing conversation analysis, which Chuck revolutionized by demonstrating the importance of visual access to the interactive construction of speakers? turns and utterances in his 1977 dissertation. Chuck Goodwin was an extraordinarily prolific scholar, whose many publications include his 1994 article ?Professional Vision,? the most cited article published to date in the *American Anthropologist*. Goodwin?s international fame as an original scholar and gifted lecturer was evidenced by countless invitations to be a plenary speaker at conferences around the world and by two degrees of doctor of philosophy honoris causa from Link?ping University and Aalbord University. His remarkable 2018 book *Co-operative Action* brings together a lifetime body of research and provides an empirically informed theory on human interaction as the systematic, creative reuse of what was just performed by other co-participants. One of the universally recognized qualities of Goodwin?s character as a scholar was his openness to other people?s ideas and research interests. His world-renowned weekly ?lab? welcomed graduate students, colleagues from a variety of departments, and a steady flow of international visitors who were eager to submit their audio-visual data to Goodwin?s ?professional vision.? On March 20, Chuck Goodwin received the news that he was the winner of the 2018 Garfinkel-Sacks Award for Distinguished Scholarship from the American Sociological Association, a well-deserved recognition of his exceptional contributions to ethnomethodology and conversation analysis, two of the many fields impacted by his creative genius. (*Alessandro Duranti*) Cite as: Duranti, Alessandro. 2018. ?Charles Goodwin.? *Anthropology News*website, May 7, 2018. DOI: 10.1111/AN.849 -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot From kim.3208@osu.edu Tue May 15 11:57:12 2018 From: kim.3208@osu.edu (Kim, Han Gil) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 18:57:12 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Difference between appropriation and learning transfer Message-ID: Dear colleagues and seasoned scholars, I am looking for useful articles/books to better understand two similar concepts (appropriation and transfer of learning). 1. Appropriation, one of the central concepts of activity theory (Grossman, Smagorinsky & Valencia 1991; Leont?ev 1981; Wertsch 1991) 2. transfer of learning, especially in the area of Writing Across Curriculum/discipline and/or L2 writing (contrastive rhetoric and English for academic purposes). Any suggestions? Thanks. ---------- Han Kim Lecturer in Korean (as a foreign language) Department of East Asian Languages and Literatures College of Arts and Sciences I am what I learn. If I have seen further, it is only by standing upon the shoulders of giants. From smago@uga.edu Tue May 15 12:13:15 2018 From: smago@uga.edu (Peter Smagorinsky) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 19:13:15 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Difference between appropriation and learning transfer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Here's one, although I no longer claim to be an activity theorist, which doesn't mean I disagree with what we said almost 20 years ago: Grossman, P. L., Smagorinsky, P., & Valencia, S. (1999). Appropriating tools for teaching English: A theoretical framework for research on learning to teach. American Journal of Education, 108(1), 1-29. Available at http://www.petersmagorinsky.net/About/PDF/AJE/AJE1999.pdf I know that in some cultural-historical thinking, "transfer" is too brittle a construct, and is more appropriately phrased as "appropriation" given that the knowledge gets adapted. I did dabble with the question of transfer, before my immersion in Vygotskian theory, in writing a really long time ago, and we questioned the idea that there is general, transferable knowledge of writing: Smagorinsky, P. & Smith, M. W. (1992). The nature of knowledge in composition and literary understanding: The question of specificity. Review of Educational Research, 62, 279-305. Available at http://www.petersmagorinsky.net/About/PDF/RER/RER1992.pdf These free texts might help: https://wac.appstate.edu/sites/wac.appstate.edu/files/images/WACRussell.pdf And there's quite a large WAC collection at https://wac.colostate.edu/books/ all free -----Original Message----- From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Kim, Han Gil Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 2:57 PM To: xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu Subject: [Xmca-l] Difference between appropriation and learning transfer Dear colleagues and seasoned scholars, I am looking for useful articles/books to better understand two similar concepts (appropriation and transfer of learning). 1. Appropriation, one of the central concepts of activity theory (Grossman, Smagorinsky & Valencia 1991; Leont?ev 1981; Wertsch 1991) 2. transfer of learning, especially in the area of Writing Across Curriculum/discipline and/or L2 writing (contrastive rhetoric and English for academic purposes). Any suggestions? Thanks. ---------- Han Kim Lecturer in Korean (as a foreign language) Department of East Asian Languages and Literatures College of Arts and Sciences I am what I learn. If I have seen further, it is only by standing upon the shoulders of giants. From a.j.gil@iped.uio.no Tue May 15 12:26:28 2018 From: a.j.gil@iped.uio.no (Alfredo Jornet Gil) Date: Tue, 15 May 2018 19:26:28 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Chuck Goodwin - RIP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1526412388854.39559@iped.uio.no> Absolutely Mike, thanks for sharing. In my opinion, a most important reference for anyone interested in questions of mind, culture, and activity. His "Professional Vision" article was a turning point in my understanding of the significance of social interaction for the understanding of human cognition. At my department, Rolf Steier and myself owe a lot to that and his other works (e.g., the blackness of black) That, and the elegance of his analyses (e.g., of girls playing hopscotch), which I still often use as model when I need to make decisions on which (shortest) parts of your empirical analyses you REALLY need to present to make an analytical point (as WM Roth does, he used to refer me to those). I am attaching the professional vision article, for those who may not be familiar, as well as for those who already know it, to continue learning. Alfredo Jornet ________________________________ New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full ________________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of mike cole Sent: 15 May 2018 19:50 To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Chuck Goodwin - RIP A valued colleague and friend from whom many of us learned a lot and are still learning. mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Charles Goodwin May 7, 2018 *Charles (Chuck) Goodwin* died on March 31, 2018, in Los Angeles, the city where he was born on October 9, 1943, and where he returned in 1996 when he was hired at the University of California, Los Angeles, in the Department of Applied Linguistics. In 2017 he retired as Distinguished Professor of Communication. >From an early age Goodwin showed an aptitude and passion for photography, a medium that he later combined with video and computer technology to capture and represent the unfolding semiotics of talk, gestures, and tool-use. After graduating from Holy Cross, where he studied English literature, and a year spent at the New York University School of Law, Goodwin went to the Annenberg School of Communication at the University of Pennsylvania. There, he was exposed to cybernetics by his advisor, Klaus Krippendorff, and to the study of face-to-face communication through his job as a research associate and filmmaker in the Philadelphia Child Guidance Clinic where Gregory Bateson?s ?systems theory? was being applied to family therapy. During this time Goodwin also met his future wife Marjorie (Candy) Harness, whose advisor was Erving Goffman, and he began to attend the latter?s courses, which were also attended by Gail Jefferson and William Labov. In 1976, Chuck and Candy Goodwin joined the department of anthropology at the University of South Carolina. Candy was completing her dissertation on Black children?s verbal virtuosity and argumentation, which debunked popular stereotypes of the difference between boys and girls? speaking styles. The turn-by-turn analysis made possible by her data played a crucial role in the Goodwins embracing conversation analysis, which Chuck revolutionized by demonstrating the importance of visual access to the interactive construction of speakers? turns and utterances in his 1977 dissertation. Chuck Goodwin was an extraordinarily prolific scholar, whose many publications include his 1994 article ?Professional Vision,? the most cited article published to date in the *American Anthropologist*. Goodwin?s international fame as an original scholar and gifted lecturer was evidenced by countless invitations to be a plenary speaker at conferences around the world and by two degrees of doctor of philosophy honoris causa from Link?ping University and Aalbord University. His remarkable 2018 book *Co-operative Action* brings together a lifetime body of research and provides an empirically informed theory on human interaction as the systematic, creative reuse of what was just performed by other co-participants. One of the universally recognized qualities of Goodwin?s character as a scholar was his openness to other people?s ideas and research interests. His world-renowned weekly ?lab? welcomed graduate students, colleagues from a variety of departments, and a steady flow of international visitors who were eager to submit their audio-visual data to Goodwin?s ?professional vision.? On March 20, Chuck Goodwin received the news that he was the winner of the 2018 Garfinkel-Sacks Award for Distinguished Scholarship from the American Sociological Association, a well-deserved recognition of his exceptional contributions to ethnomethodology and conversation analysis, two of the many fields impacted by his creative genius. (*Alessandro Duranti*) Cite as: Duranti, Alessandro. 2018. ?Charles Goodwin.? *Anthropology News*website, May 7, 2018. DOI: 10.1111/AN.849 -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Goodwin 1994 Professional Vision.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 4444853 bytes Desc: Goodwin 1994 Professional Vision.pdf Url : http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180515/52df9c48/attachment-0001.pdf From huw.softdesigns@gmail.com Wed May 16 03:42:18 2018 From: huw.softdesigns@gmail.com (Huw Lloyd) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 11:42:18 +0100 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Difference between appropriation and learning transfer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Han Kim, Fundamentally AT is about development, not appropriation. So you might say appropriation was appropriated (an inevitable outcome). This is from Luria (1961): "It would not be wrong to say that the basic principle of Soviet psychology is the idea of development, the proposition that such mental activities as intelligent perception, purposive memory, active attention and deliberate action result from a lengthy evolution in a child's actual behavior." Development as distinct from conventional notions of learning is more difficult to communicate, perhaps because it often entails development. Reorganisation of the means of learning is a good starting point, which is what the notion of transfer implicitly points to, i.e. that which is beyond superficial learning. Probably the most succinct pointing to the distinction is in the experimental work of Gal'perin. Best, Huw On 15 May 2018 at 19:57, Kim, Han Gil wrote: > Dear colleagues and seasoned scholars, > > I am looking for useful articles/books to better understand two similar > concepts (appropriation and transfer of learning). > > 1. Appropriation, one of the central concepts of activity theory > (Grossman, Smagorinsky & Valencia 1991; Leont?ev 1981; Wertsch 1991) > > 2. transfer of learning, especially in the area of Writing Across > Curriculum/discipline and/or L2 writing (contrastive rhetoric and English > for academic purposes). > > Any suggestions? > Thanks. > > ---------- > Han Kim > > Lecturer in Korean (as a foreign language) > Department of East Asian Languages and Literatures > College of Arts and Sciences > > I am what I learn. If I have seen further, it is only by standing upon the > shoulders of giants. > > From jamesma320@gmail.com Wed May 16 04:29:45 2018 From: jamesma320@gmail.com (James Ma) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 12:29:45 +0100 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Difference between appropriation and learning transfer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Han Kim, Another neo-Vygotskian theorist using the term appropriation was Barbara Rogoff in "Apprenticeship in Thinking" (1990). James Wertsch also used it in "Mind as Action" (1998). Above all, Bakhtin's "The Dialogic Imagination" is very important. James *________________________________________________* *James Ma Independent Scholar **https://oxford.academia.edu/JamesMa * On 16 May 2018 at 11:42, Huw Lloyd wrote: > Han Kim, > > Fundamentally AT is about development, not appropriation. So you might say > appropriation was appropriated (an inevitable outcome). This is from Luria > (1961): "It would not be wrong to say that the basic principle of Soviet > psychology is the idea of development, the proposition that such mental > activities as intelligent perception, purposive memory, active attention > and deliberate action result from a lengthy evolution in a child's actual > behavior." > > Development as distinct from conventional notions of learning is more > difficult to communicate, perhaps because it often entails development. > Reorganisation of the means of learning is a good starting point, which is > what the notion of transfer implicitly points to, i.e. that which is beyond > superficial learning. Probably the most succinct pointing to the > distinction is in the experimental work of Gal'perin. > > Best, > Huw > > On 15 May 2018 at 19:57, Kim, Han Gil wrote: > > > Dear colleagues and seasoned scholars, > > > > I am looking for useful articles/books to better understand two similar > > concepts (appropriation and transfer of learning). > > > > 1. Appropriation, one of the central concepts of activity theory > > (Grossman, Smagorinsky & Valencia 1991; Leont?ev 1981; Wertsch 1991) > > > > 2. transfer of learning, especially in the area of Writing Across > > Curriculum/discipline and/or L2 writing (contrastive rhetoric and English > > for academic purposes). > > > > Any suggestions? > > Thanks. > > > > ---------- > > Han Kim > > > > Lecturer in Korean (as a foreign language) > > Department of East Asian Languages and Literatures > > College of Arts and Sciences > > > > I am what I learn. If I have seen further, it is only by standing upon > the > > shoulders of giants. > > > > > Virus-free. www.avast.com <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> From a.j.gil@iped.uio.no Wed May 16 04:33:48 2018 From: a.j.gil@iped.uio.no (Alfredo Jornet Gil) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 11:33:48 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Difference between appropriation and learning transfer In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: <1526470427732.51707@iped.uio.no> Hi James, sorry if I go a bit off-topic because of my ignorance, but what does "neo-Vygotskian" mean? Alfredo Jornet ________________________________ New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full ________________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of James Ma Sent: 16 May 2018 13:29 To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Difference between appropriation and learning transfer Hello Han Kim, Another neo-Vygotskian theorist using the term appropriation was Barbara Rogoff in "Apprenticeship in Thinking" (1990). James Wertsch also used it in "Mind as Action" (1998). Above all, Bakhtin's "The Dialogic Imagination" is very important. James *________________________________________________* *James Ma Independent Scholar **https://oxford.academia.edu/JamesMa * On 16 May 2018 at 11:42, Huw Lloyd wrote: > Han Kim, > > Fundamentally AT is about development, not appropriation. So you might say > appropriation was appropriated (an inevitable outcome). This is from Luria > (1961): "It would not be wrong to say that the basic principle of Soviet > psychology is the idea of development, the proposition that such mental > activities as intelligent perception, purposive memory, active attention > and deliberate action result from a lengthy evolution in a child's actual > behavior." > > Development as distinct from conventional notions of learning is more > difficult to communicate, perhaps because it often entails development. > Reorganisation of the means of learning is a good starting point, which is > what the notion of transfer implicitly points to, i.e. that which is beyond > superficial learning. Probably the most succinct pointing to the > distinction is in the experimental work of Gal'perin. > > Best, > Huw > > On 15 May 2018 at 19:57, Kim, Han Gil wrote: > > > Dear colleagues and seasoned scholars, > > > > I am looking for useful articles/books to better understand two similar > > concepts (appropriation and transfer of learning). > > > > 1. Appropriation, one of the central concepts of activity theory > > (Grossman, Smagorinsky & Valencia 1991; Leont?ev 1981; Wertsch 1991) > > > > 2. transfer of learning, especially in the area of Writing Across > > Curriculum/discipline and/or L2 writing (contrastive rhetoric and English > > for academic purposes). > > > > Any suggestions? > > Thanks. > > > > ---------- > > Han Kim > > > > Lecturer in Korean (as a foreign language) > > Department of East Asian Languages and Literatures > > College of Arts and Sciences > > > > I am what I learn. If I have seen further, it is only by standing upon > the > > shoulders of giants. > > > > > Virus-free. www.avast.com <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> From jamesma320@gmail.com Wed May 16 04:53:07 2018 From: jamesma320@gmail.com (James Ma) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 12:53:07 +0100 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Difference between appropriation and learning transfer In-Reply-To: <1526470427732.51707@iped.uio.no> References: <1526470427732.51707@iped.uio.no> Message-ID: Hello Alfredo, personally I see neo-Vygotskians as those who don't tend to use Vygotsky's terms but create their own, i.e. appropriate or adapt them to their own purposes. In fact I remember Rogoff explaining Bakhtin's appropriation that way when she came to Bristol in 2001. Best, James Alfredo Jornet Gil ? 2018?5?16??? 12:34??? > Hi James, > > sorry if I go a bit off-topic because of my ignorance, but what does > "neo-Vygotskian" mean? > > Alfredo Jornet > ________________________________ > New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, > "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print > available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full > > > ________________________________________ > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu > on behalf of James Ma > Sent: 16 May 2018 13:29 > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Difference between appropriation and learning > transfer > > Hello Han Kim, > Another neo-Vygotskian theorist using the term appropriation was Barbara > Rogoff in "Apprenticeship in Thinking" (1990). > James Wertsch also used it in "Mind as Action" (1998). > Above all, Bakhtin's "The Dialogic Imagination" is very important. > James > > > *________________________________________________* > > *James Ma Independent Scholar **https://oxford.academia.edu/JamesMa > * > > > > On 16 May 2018 at 11:42, Huw Lloyd wrote: > > > Han Kim, > > > > Fundamentally AT is about development, not appropriation. So you might > say > > appropriation was appropriated (an inevitable outcome). This is from > Luria > > (1961): "It would not be wrong to say that the basic principle of Soviet > > psychology is the idea of development, the proposition that such mental > > activities as intelligent perception, purposive memory, active attention > > and deliberate action result from a lengthy evolution in a child's actual > > behavior." > > > > Development as distinct from conventional notions of learning is more > > difficult to communicate, perhaps because it often entails development. > > Reorganisation of the means of learning is a good starting point, which > is > > what the notion of transfer implicitly points to, i.e. that which is > beyond > > superficial learning. Probably the most succinct pointing to the > > distinction is in the experimental work of Gal'perin. > > > > Best, > > Huw > > > > On 15 May 2018 at 19:57, Kim, Han Gil wrote: > > > > > Dear colleagues and seasoned scholars, > > > > > > I am looking for useful articles/books to better understand two similar > > > concepts (appropriation and transfer of learning). > > > > > > 1. Appropriation, one of the central concepts of activity theory > > > (Grossman, Smagorinsky & Valencia 1991; Leont?ev 1981; Wertsch 1991) > > > > > > 2. transfer of learning, especially in the area of Writing Across > > > Curriculum/discipline and/or L2 writing (contrastive rhetoric and > English > > > for academic purposes). > > > > > > Any suggestions? > > > Thanks. > > > > > > ---------- > > > Han Kim > > > > > > Lecturer in Korean (as a foreign language) > > > Department of East Asian Languages and Literatures > > > College of Arts and Sciences > > > > > > I am what I learn. If I have seen further, it is only by standing upon > > the > > > shoulders of giants. > > > > > > > > > > > < > https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail > > > Virus-free. > www.avast.com > < > https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail > > > <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > > From mcole@ucsd.edu Wed May 16 11:36:02 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 11:36:02 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Fwd: Please come to the first-ever HxA conference: June 15, NYC In-Reply-To: References: <4DA997E1-49F0-422F-9F9D-E4050359FF6C@uchicago.edu> Message-ID: For New Yorkers on this list mike, *From:* Jonathan Haidt *Date:* May 10, 2018 at 5:32:55 PM CDT *To:* Laura Lalinde , *Subject:* *Please come to the first-ever HxA conference: June 15, NYC* On Friday June 15, Heterodox Academy will host a day-long conference at The Times Center in Manhattan to explore ways to improve viewpoint diversity, open inquiry, and constructive disagreement on college campuses. We have an extraordinary list of speakers lined up, including the presidents of the University of Chicago and Wesleyan University; Nadine Strossen (former president of ACLU); Alice Dreger (formerly of Northwestern); Glenn Loury (Brown); Richard Shweder (Chicago), and many others. You can see the full list here , and you can see the full agenda here . You can also see who won our first-ever awards for leadership, courage, scholarship, and institutional excellence. So many of us in higher education are puzzled by what is happening, and how best to teach and lead in a rapidly changing campus climate, nested within an increasingly polarized democracy whose problems are amplified by social media. On June 15 we will make progress toward understanding our predicament and our way forward. If you?re interested, please click here to register , before we begin advertising it to the general public next week. If you have friends or students who might be able to attend, please forward this email to them. If you have any questions, please don?t hesitate to contact Laura Lalinde at lalinde@heterodoxacademy.org. I hope you can join us in New York City. (The sessions will be recorded and made available afterward, but it will be a lot more fun to be there, together.) jon -- Jonathan Haidt Thomas Cooley Professor of Ethical Leadership NYU-Stern School of Business Business and Society Program, KMC Suite 7-150 44 West 4th Street, New York, NY 10012 jhaidt@stern.nyu.edu, (212) 992-6802, @JonHaidt www.JonathanHaidt.com (All publications available here) www.RighteousMind.com , www.EthicalSystems.org Coming Sept 4: The Coddling of the American Mind -- To save everyone's inbox, "reply to all" is disabled for this list. If you have any questions about HxA emails or membership, please email or forward this email directly to willinger@heterodoxacademy.org --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "HXA-announcements" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to hxa-announcements+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to hxa-announcements@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/ msgid/hxa-announcements/CAHkkoXY-JBBe9hW9h72rj%2B6s% 2BARO2qs-GkhyL_kgpYYkbwEMyw%40mail.gmail.com . For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot From mpacker@cantab.net Wed May 16 17:44:55 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 19:44:55 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] testing... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1DB94F21-12A1-4545-AEA0-F486BC467407@cantab.net> Martin From mpacker@cantab.net Wed May 16 18:50:57 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 20:50:57 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] please, please, please... In-Reply-To: <1DB94F21-12A1-4545-AEA0-F486BC467407@cantab.net> References: <1DB94F21-12A1-4545-AEA0-F486BC467407@cantab.net> Message-ID: <76B63396-6FAF-40B1-BB15-DC3755D59E9D@cantab.net> Martin > From greg.a.thompson@gmail.com Wed May 16 19:28:55 2018 From: greg.a.thompson@gmail.com (Greg Thompson) Date: Thu, 17 May 2018 11:28:55 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: please, please, please... In-Reply-To: <76B63396-6FAF-40B1-BB15-DC3755D59E9D@cantab.net> References: <1DB94F21-12A1-4545-AEA0-F486BC467407@cantab.net> <76B63396-6FAF-40B1-BB15-DC3755D59E9D@cantab.net> Message-ID: yes, very sorry about this. adjusting to Korea and getting my students situated here took more time than I hoped. I'm teaching later today but then tomorrow looks glorious for completing this and sending it along to you. With apologies, greg On Thu, May 17, 2018 at 10:50 AM, Martin Packer wrote: > > Martin > > > > > -- Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Department of Anthropology 880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602 WEBSITE: greg.a.thompson.byu.edu http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson From mpacker@cantab.net Wed May 16 20:10:14 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 22:10:14 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: please, please, please... In-Reply-To: References: <1DB94F21-12A1-4545-AEA0-F486BC467407@cantab.net> <76B63396-6FAF-40B1-BB15-DC3755D59E9D@cantab.net> Message-ID: <31CE4B03-5392-4BF6-82A5-71DD70EF312E@cantab.net> ??? Martin > On May 16, 2018, at 9:28 PM, Greg Thompson wrote: > > yes, very sorry about this. adjusting to Korea and getting my students > situated here took more time than I hoped. > > I'm teaching later today but then tomorrow looks glorious for completing > this and sending it along to you. > > With apologies, > greg > > > On Thu, May 17, 2018 at 10:50 AM, Martin Packer wrote: > >> >> Martin >> >>> >> >> > > > -- > Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D. > Assistant Professor > Department of Anthropology > 880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower > Brigham Young University > Provo, UT 84602 > WEBSITE: greg.a.thompson.byu.edu > http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson From marina.everri@unipr.it Thu May 17 02:55:06 2018 From: marina.everri@unipr.it (Marina EVERRI) Date: Thu, 17 May 2018 11:55:06 +0200 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Chuck Goodwin - RIP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20180517095225.M58392@unipr.it> Extremely sorry to hear this. I attended his course and he was a great source of inspiration during my phd training:( marina On Tue, 15 May 2018 10:50:05 -0700, mike cole wrote > A valued colleague and friend from whom many of us learned a lot and > are still learning. > > mike > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Charles Goodwin > May 7, 2018 > > *Charles (Chuck) Goodwin* died on March 31, 2018, in Los Angeles, > the city where he was born on October 9, 1943, and where he > returned in 1996 when he was hired at the University of California, > Los Angeles, in the Department of Applied Linguistics. In 2017 he > retired as Distinguished Professor of Communication. > > >From an early age Goodwin showed an aptitude and passion for photography, a > medium that he later combined with video and computer technology to capture > and represent the unfolding semiotics of talk, gestures, and tool- > use. After graduating from Holy Cross, where he studied English > literature, and a year spent at the New York University School of > Law, Goodwin went to the Annenberg School of Communication at the > University of Pennsylvania. There, he was exposed to cybernetics by > his advisor, Klaus Krippendorff, and to the study of face-to-face > communication through his job as a research associate and filmmaker > in the Philadelphia Child Guidance Clinic where Gregory Bateson?s > ?systems theory? was being applied to family therapy. During > this time Goodwin also met his future wife Marjorie (Candy) Harness, > whose advisor was Erving Goffman, and he began to attend the latter?s > courses, which were also attended by Gail Jefferson and William Labov. > > In 1976, Chuck and Candy Goodwin joined the department of > anthropology at the University of South Carolina. Candy was > completing her dissertation on Black children?s verbal virtuosity > and argumentation, which debunked popular stereotypes of the > difference between boys and girls? speaking styles. The turn-by- > turn analysis made possible by her data played a crucial role in the > Goodwins embracing conversation analysis, which Chuck revolutionized > by demonstrating the importance of visual access to the interactive > construction of speakers? turns and utterances in his 1977 dissertation. > > Chuck Goodwin was an extraordinarily prolific scholar, whose many > publications include his 1994 article ?Professional Vision,? the > most cited article published to date in the *American > Anthropologist*. Goodwin?s international fame as an original > scholar and gifted lecturer was evidenced by countless invitations > to be a plenary speaker at conferences around the world and by two > degrees of doctor of philosophy honoris causa from Link?ping > University and Aalbord University. > > His remarkable 2018 book *Co-operative Action* > > brings together a lifetime body of research and provides an empirically > informed theory on human interaction as the systematic, creative > reuse of what was just performed by other co-participants. > > One of the universally recognized qualities of Goodwin?s character > as a scholar was his openness to other people?s ideas and research > interests. His world-renowned weekly ?lab? welcomed graduate > students, colleagues from a variety of departments, and a steady > flow of international visitors who were eager to submit their audio- > visual data to Goodwin?s ?professional vision.? > > On March 20, Chuck Goodwin received the news that he was the winner > of the 2018 Garfinkel-Sacks Award for Distinguished Scholarship from > the American Sociological Association, a well-deserved recognition > of his exceptional contributions to ethnomethodology and > conversation analysis, two of the many fields impacted by his > creative genius. (*Alessandro Duranti*) > > Cite as: Duranti, Alessandro. 2018. ?Charles Goodwin.? *Anthropology > News*website, > May 7, 2018. DOI: 10.1111/AN.849 > > -- > A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being > masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the > most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. > ---George Eliot Marina Everri CPsychol, MFT, PhD Visiting fellow Department of Media and Communications London School of Economics and Political Science Head of Research @Zeeko-NovaUCD University College Dublin Belfield, Dublin 4, Ireland Twitter: AdoDigitFamX Facebook: Dis/connessioni Phone: +44 (0) 7856 707986 La cultura ? organizzazione, disciplina del proprio io interiore; ? presa di possesso della propria personalit?, e conquista di coscienza superiore, per la quale si riesce a comprendere il pr Firma il tuo 5 x mille all?Universit? di Parma e aiuta cos? i nostri studenti che vogliono realizzare un?esperienza di studio all?estero ? Indica 00308780345 nella tua denuncia dei redditi. From greg.a.thompson@gmail.com Thu May 17 14:37:52 2018 From: greg.a.thompson@gmail.com (Greg Thompson) Date: Fri, 18 May 2018 06:37:52 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Fwd: [AAA_ACYIG] Call For Papers: Youth, Inequality and Social Change in the Global South In-Reply-To: <2B1F7F97-98C9-4C40-8CBE-123CE2EE30C0@jh.edu> References: <2B1F7F97-98C9-4C40-8CBE-123CE2EE30C0@jh.edu> Message-ID: Just forwarding this in case anyone is interested. -greg ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Dori Beeler Date: Thu, May 17, 2018 at 9:51 PM Subject: [AAA_ACYIG] Call For Papers: Youth, Inequality and Social Change in the Global South To: "aaa_acyig@binhost.com" **Apologies for cross posting* See below for a call for papers.* Dear colleagues, We hope this email finds you well. We are delighted to release this Call for Papers for our edited book ?Youth, Inequality and Social Change in the Global South?. The book will be published in the series *Perspectives on Children and Young People* by Springer. As an initial step, we are releasing a call for abstracts (200 words) for potential chapters. For more information about this edited book, please find attached a flyer. The important dates for this book process are: Abstract 200 words: 10 October 2017 Notification of outcome: 30 October 2017 First chapter draft: 1 March 2018 Final chapter: 31 May 2018 Best regards, Hern?n & Ana *Hern?n Cuervo (PhD)* Associate Dean (Diversity & Inclusion) Senior Lecturer | Research Fellow Youth Research Centre Melbourne Graduate School of Education The University of Melbourne, Victoria 3010 Australia *T: *+61 3 83449533 <+61%203%208344%209533> twitter.com/YRCunimelb *| * education.unimelb.edu.au/yrc [image: cid:image001.png@01D137F5.8E5D7620] *P* *Please consider the environment before printing this email* This email and any attachments may contain personal information or information that is otherwise confidential or the subject of copyright. Any use, disclosure or copying of any part of it is prohibited. The University does not warrant that this email or any attachments are free from viruses or defects. Please check any attachments for viruses and defects before opening them. If this email is received in error please delete it and notify us by return email. _______________________________________________ American Anthropological Association's Anthropology of Children and Youth Interest Group Listserv. AAA_ACYIG@binhost.com To view the message archives, please visit: https://lists.capalon.com/pipermail/aaa_acyig/ For help with this list, please contact the List Administrator acyig.aaa AT gmail DOT com You may also manage your own subscription preferences at: https://lists.capalon.com/lists/listinfo/aaa_acyig Note: To stop receiving email from this list, please set your account to DISABLED. ACYIG hosts Collaborative Research Networks! Visit the sites for CRN Mobilities, CRN Lifecourse, and/or CRN Students to sign up for their listservs (http://acyig.americananthro.org/crns/). AAA_ACYIG mailing list AAA_ACYIG@binhost.com https://lists.capalon.com/lists/listinfo/aaa_acyig -- Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Department of Anthropology 880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602 WEBSITE: greg.a.thompson.byu.edu http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.png Type: image/png Size: 27694 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180518/032331fc/attachment.png From dkellogg60@gmail.com Fri May 18 18:53:46 2018 From: dkellogg60@gmail.com (David Kellogg) Date: Sat, 19 May 2018 10:53:46 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Conditional and Conditioned Message-ID: Mike makes the point, in an earlier thread, that if we do not understand what Pavlov meant by "conditional response"--if, for example, we assimilate it to operant conditioning on the one hand or reflexology on the other--we do not understand the type of claim that Pavlov was making, nor the position that Pavlov's work takes up in Vygotsky's development. So what is the difference that makes a difference? Pavlov takes the response as given by natural conditions rather than by a conditioned system (e.g. designed and designated rewards and punishments). At the same time, Pavlov takes the response as being neurologically ordered rather than simply reflexive and mechanical (and so potentially open to explaining language through a "second signal system"). Pavlov is working in a good old Russian interpretation of Darwin which was (as Loren Graham points out) a kind of "Through the Looking Glass" version of our own. 19th Century America happily accepted the Spencerian formula "survival of the fittest" but rejected the mutability of species; Russians came to precisely the opposite conclusion (as did Darwin himself). Pavlov sees species as endlessly mutable, and the conditional response is part of that infiinite mutability. It includes the possibility of self-mutability--something that, as Vygotsky points out, opens the door to a synthesis of Darwin and Lamarck, as far as cultural forms of behavior are concerned. At the same time, there is something immutable in Pavlov that Vygotsky in turn rejects, Pavlov sees the response as given by nature and the condition as given by nurture, and for Vygotsky this division is too elemental to be interesting in the understanding of cultural forms of behavior: if the condition is both "natural" and "human", then it makes no sense to argue that the response is merely the former. A dog that can ring its own bell is a very different species indeed. Take, for example, a classroom situation. If we take children's responses as conditional, their source is always in the classroom environment (physical punishments, and tangible rewards, the real apple and not the apple of the imagination, as Bleuler says). But if we take chlidren's response as conditioned, their source is ultimately the child (the satisfactions of peer recognition, teacher praise, self-praise, or simply turning out to have the right answer).There is absolutely nothing preventing the child from emancipating himself or herself from peers, teachers, and even a pre-determined right answer. The continuation of development beyond this point of self-emancipation cannot be explained at all. David Kellogg Sangmyung University Recent Article in Language Sciences A science for verbal art: Elizabeth Gaskell's contribution to a critique of political economy https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0388000117303534 Fang Li and David Kellogg., https://doi.org/10.1016/j.langsci.2018.05.001 From vwilk@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp Fri May 18 20:32:02 2018 From: vwilk@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp (vwilk@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp) Date: Sat, 19 May 2018 12:32:02 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Conditional and Conditioned In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20180519033202.00002814.0636@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp> It's May, mid semester in Japan, and how are all of you? David K. says: "So what is the difference that makes a difference?" And it gives me a chance to stick my figurative oar in, saying "them's Bateson's words." Bateson's definition of "information" in Mind And Nature: A Necessary Unity is exactly, "Any difference that makes a difference." Dicing logic fine, working with binaries in organismic systems, sometimes creates polarities that polarise rather dynamic interaction that produces new avenues of connection. As always, David's quick take is illuminating, evocative, and informative. Kind regards, Vandy ----- Original Message ----- > Mike makes the point, in an earlier thread, that if we do not understand > what Pavlov meant by "conditional response"--if, for example, we assimilate > it to operant conditioning on the one hand or reflexology on the other --we > do not understand the type of claim that Pavlov was making, nor the > position that Pavlov's work takes up in Vygotsky's development. > > So what is the difference that makes a difference? Pavlov takes the > response as given by natural conditions rather than by a conditioned > system (e.g. designed and designated rewards and punishments). At the same > time, Pavlov takes the response as being neurologically ordered rather than > simply reflexive and mechanical (and so potentially open to explaining > language through a "second signal system"). > > Pavlov is working in a good old Russian interpretation of Darwin which was > (as Loren Graham points out) a kind of "Through the Looking Glass" version > of our own. 19th Century America happily accepted the Spencerian formula > "survival of the fittest" but rejected the mutability of species; Russians > came to precisely the opposite conclusion (as did Darwin himself). > > Pavlov sees species as endlessly mutable, and the conditional response is > part of that infiinite mutability. It includes the possibility of > self-mutability--something that, as Vygotsky points out, opens the door to > a synthesis of Darwin and Lamarck, as far as cultural forms of behavior are > concerned. > > At the same time, there is something immutable in Pavlov that Vygotsky in > turn rejects, Pavlov sees the response as given by nature and the > condition as given by nurture, and for Vygotsky this division is too > elemental to be interesting in the understanding of cultural forms of > behavior: if the condition is both "natural" and "human", then it makes no > sense to argue that the response is merely the former. A dog that can ring > its own bell is a very different species indeed. > > Take, for example, a classroom situation. If we take children's responses > as conditional, their source is always in the classroom environment > (physical punishments, and tangible rewards, the real apple and not the > apple of the imagination, as Bleuler says). But if we take chlidren's > response as conditioned, their source is ultimately the child (the > satisfactions of peer recognition, teacher praise, self-praise, or simply > turning out to have the right answer).There is absolutely nothing > preventing the child from emancipating himself or herself from peers, > teachers, and even a pre-determined right answer. The continuation of > development beyond this point of self-emancipation cannot be explained at > all. > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > Recent Article in Language Sciences > > A science for verbal art: Elizabeth Gaskell's contribution to a critique of > political economy > > https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0388000117303534 > > Fang Li and David Kellogg., > > https://doi.org/10.1016/j.langsci.2018.05.001 > > > From hshonerd@gmail.com Sat May 19 08:36:56 2018 From: hshonerd@gmail.com (HENRY SHONERD) Date: Sat, 19 May 2018 09:36:56 -0600 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Conditional and Conditioned In-Reply-To: <20180519033202.00002814.0636@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp> References: <20180519033202.00002814.0636@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp> Message-ID: David and Vandy, How about free will here? I listen to a podcast very often called ?Waking Up? with Sam Harris. Two things he is always saying: ?Religion is bullshit? and free will and choice are not the same. At the point that David describes in the classroom: " There is absolutely nothing preventing the child from emancipating himself or herself from peers, teachers, and even a pre-determined right answer. The continuation of development beyond this point of self-emancipation cannot be at all.? At this point, is it free will, choice, or some mix? Henry > On May 18, 2018, at 9:32 PM, vwilk@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp wrote: > > > It's May, mid semester in Japan, and how are all of you? > > David K. says: "So what is the difference that makes a difference?" > And it gives me a chance to stick my figurative oar in, saying "them's > Bateson's words." > Bateson's definition of "information" in Mind And Nature: A Necessary > Unity > is exactly, "Any difference that makes a difference." > > Dicing logic fine, working with binaries in organismic systems, > sometimes creates polarities that polarise > rather dynamic interaction that produces new avenues of connection. > > As always, David's quick take is illuminating, evocative, and > informative. > Kind regards, > Vandy > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> Mike makes the point, in an earlier thread, that if we do not > understand >> what Pavlov meant by "conditional response"--if, for example, we > assimilate >> it to operant conditioning on the one hand or reflexology on the other > --we >> do not understand the type of claim that Pavlov was making, nor the >> position that Pavlov's work takes up in Vygotsky's development. >> >> So what is the difference that makes a difference? Pavlov takes the >> response as given by natural conditions rather than by a conditioned >> system (e.g. designed and designated rewards and punishments). At the > same >> time, Pavlov takes the response as being neurologically ordered rather > than >> simply reflexive and mechanical (and so potentially open to explaining >> language through a "second signal system"). >> >> Pavlov is working in a good old Russian interpretation of Darwin which > was >> (as Loren Graham points out) a kind of "Through the Looking Glass" > version >> of our own. 19th Century America happily accepted the Spencerian > formula >> "survival of the fittest" but rejected the mutability of species; > Russians >> came to precisely the opposite conclusion (as did Darwin himself). >> >> Pavlov sees species as endlessly mutable, and the conditional response > is >> part of that infiinite mutability. It includes the possibility of >> self-mutability--something that, as Vygotsky points out, opens the > door to >> a synthesis of Darwin and Lamarck, as far as cultural forms of > behavior are >> concerned. >> >> At the same time, there is something immutable in Pavlov that Vygotsky > in >> turn rejects, Pavlov sees the response as given by nature and the >> condition as given by nurture, and for Vygotsky this division is too >> elemental to be interesting in the understanding of cultural forms of >> behavior: if the condition is both "natural" and "human", then it > makes no >> sense to argue that the response is merely the former. A dog that can > ring >> its own bell is a very different species indeed. >> >> Take, for example, a classroom situation. If we take children's > responses >> as conditional, their source is always in the classroom environment >> (physical punishments, and tangible rewards, the real apple and not > the >> apple of the imagination, as Bleuler says). But if we take chlidren's >> response as conditioned, their source is ultimately the child (the >> satisfactions of peer recognition, teacher praise, self-praise, or > simply >> turning out to have the right answer).There is absolutely nothing >> preventing the child from emancipating himself or herself from peers, >> teachers, and even a pre-determined right answer. The continuation of >> development beyond this point of self-emancipation cannot be explained > at >> all. >> >> David Kellogg >> Sangmyung University >> >> Recent Article in Language Sciences >> >> A science for verbal art: Elizabeth Gaskell's contribution to a > critique of >> political economy >> >> https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0388000117303534 >> >> Fang Li and David Kellogg., >> >> https://doi.org/10.1016/j.langsci.2018.05.001 >> >> >> > > > > From h2cmng@yahoo.co.uk Sat May 19 09:14:46 2018 From: h2cmng@yahoo.co.uk (peter jones) Date: Sat, 19 May 2018 16:14:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Conditional and Conditioned In-Reply-To: References: <20180519033202.00002814.0636@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp> Message-ID: <1363599404.5357157.1526746486433@mail.yahoo.com> Of possible interest ... (Subscription needed for online, but initial complimentary access is granted. I have hard copy.) Free Will Is Still Alive! | | | | | | | | | | | Free Will Is Still Alive! | Issue 124 | Philosophy Now Carlo Filice questions recent attempts to question free will. | | | Peter Jones Community Mental Health Nurse & Researcher CMHT Brookside Aughton Street Ormskirk L39 3BH, UK +44 01695 684700 Blogging at "Welcome to the QUAD" http://hodges-model.blogspot.com/ http://twitter.com/h2cm On Saturday, 19 May 2018, 16:38:20 GMT+1, HENRY SHONERD wrote: David and Vandy, How about free will here? I listen to a podcast very often called ?Waking Up? with Sam Harris. Two things he is always saying: ?Religion is bullshit? and free will and choice are not the same. At the point that David describes in the classroom: " There is absolutely nothing preventing the child from emancipating himself or herself from peers, teachers, and even a pre-determined right answer. The continuation of development beyond this point of self-emancipation cannot be at all.? At this point, is it free will, choice, or some mix? Henry > On May 18, 2018, at 9:32 PM, vwilk@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp wrote: > > > It's May, mid semester in Japan, and how are all of you? > > David K. says: "So what is the difference that makes a difference?" > And it gives me a chance to stick my figurative oar in, saying "them's > Bateson's words." > Bateson's definition of "information" in Mind And Nature: A Necessary > Unity > is exactly, "Any difference that makes a difference." > > Dicing logic fine, working with binaries in organismic systems, > sometimes creates polarities that polarise > rather dynamic interaction that produces new avenues of connection. > > As always, David's quick take is illuminating, evocative, and > informative. > Kind regards, > Vandy > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> Mike makes the point, in an earlier thread, that if we do not > understand >> what Pavlov meant by "conditional response"--if, for example, we > assimilate >> it to operant conditioning on the one hand or reflexology on the other > --we >> do not understand the type of claim that Pavlov was making, nor the >> position that Pavlov's work takes up in Vygotsky's development. >> >> So what is the difference that makes a difference? Pavlov takes the >> response as given by natural conditions rather than by a conditioned >> system (e.g. designed and designated rewards and punishments). At the > same >> time, Pavlov takes the response as being neurologically ordered rather > than >> simply reflexive and mechanical (and so potentially open to explaining >> language through a "second signal system"). >> >> Pavlov is working in a good old Russian interpretation of Darwin which > was >> (as Loren Graham points out) a kind of "Through the Looking Glass" > version >> of our own. 19th Century America happily accepted the Spencerian > formula >> "survival of the fittest" but rejected the mutability of species; > Russians >> came to precisely the opposite conclusion (as did Darwin himself). >> >> Pavlov sees species as endlessly mutable, and the conditional response > is >> part of that infiinite mutability. It includes the possibility of >> self-mutability--something that, as Vygotsky points out, opens the > door to >> a synthesis of Darwin and Lamarck, as far as cultural forms of > behavior are >> concerned. >> >> At the same time, there is something immutable in Pavlov that Vygotsky > in >> turn rejects,? Pavlov sees the response as given by nature and the >> condition as given by nurture, and for Vygotsky this division is too >> elemental to be interesting in the understanding of cultural forms of >> behavior: if the condition is both "natural" and "human", then it > makes no >> sense to argue that the response is merely the former. A dog that can > ring >> its own bell is a very different species indeed. >> >> Take, for example, a classroom situation. If we take children's > responses >> as conditional, their source is always in the classroom environment >> (physical punishments, and tangible rewards, the real apple and not > the >> apple of the imagination, as Bleuler says). But if we take chlidren's >> response as conditioned, their source is ultimately the child (the >> satisfactions of peer recognition, teacher praise, self-praise, or > simply >> turning out to have the right answer).There is absolutely nothing >> preventing the child from emancipating himself or herself from peers, >> teachers, and even a pre-determined right answer. The continuation of >> development beyond this point of self-emancipation cannot be explained > at >> all. >> >> David Kellogg >> Sangmyung University >> >> Recent Article in Language Sciences >> >> A science for verbal art: Elizabeth Gaskell's contribution to a > critique of >> political economy >> >> https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0388000117303534 >> >> Fang Li and David Kellogg., >> >> https://doi.org/10.1016/j.langsci.2018.05.001 >> >> >> > > > > From dkellogg60@gmail.com Sat May 19 22:44:43 2018 From: dkellogg60@gmail.com (David Kellogg) Date: Sun, 20 May 2018 14:44:43 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Conditional and Conditioned In-Reply-To: References: <20180519033202.00002814.0636@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp> Message-ID: So in Chapters 3-5 of HDHMF, Vygotsky takes up Buhler's distinction between instinct (unconditional response), habit (conditional response), and intelligence (essentially, an unstimulated response). He criticizes Buhler for over-extending the distinction. On the one hand, he points out that these are not equally present in animals and humans (as Buhler claims) and on the other he notes that they are ALL present in the very first year of human life, alongside acts of free will (necessity's recognition and re-cognition as choice). Acts of free will are completely senseless: they are neither intelligent, nor habitual, nor instinctive. I think, Henry, your man Harris would do well to read over Vandy's admittedly rather cryptic comments on Bateson, on dicing logic, on the inability of binaries to explain how you get a binary in the first place. Really, to say that religion is bullshit is like saying science is bunk, because religion is essentially pre-science. Obviously, cooking is different from ordering from the menu. But if you can't explain how you get binaries in the first place, you are really in the same position as Christians who argue for the eternal co-existence of a Trinity, or Muslims who argued that Allah and the Quran are equally eternal. No one is more dualistic than a synoptic monotheist. The problem is explaining how instinct is different from habit, how habit differs from intelligence, and how intelligence from free will. Instinct is given at birth, and in that sense it is "unconditioned" as well as unconditional. Habits are learned, and in that sense they are both conditioned and conditional. I think Mike was objecting to "conditioned" because it turns what was essentially a logical claim ("If p then q") into a purely genetic one (conditioned and unconditioned response arise under different conditions). But for Vygotsky the logical claim is too broad to be useful, and the genetic one too narrow. Besides, it's the genetic approach and only the genetic approach that really helps us explain how the two things can be both linked and distinct. David Kellogg Sangmyung University Recent Article in Language Sciences A science for verbal art: Elizabeth Gaskell's contribution to a critique of political economy https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0388000117303534 Fang Li and David Kellogg., https://doi.org/10.1016/j.langsci.2018.05.001 On Sun, May 20, 2018 at 12:36 AM, HENRY SHONERD wrote: > David and Vandy, > How about free will here? I listen to a podcast very often called ?Waking > Up? with Sam Harris. Two things he is always saying: ?Religion is bullshit? > and free will and choice are not the same. At the point that David > describes in the classroom: " There is absolutely nothing preventing the > child from emancipating himself or herself from peers, teachers, and even a > pre-determined right answer. The continuation of development beyond this > point of self-emancipation cannot be at all.? At this point, is it free > will, choice, or some mix? > Henry > > > > On May 18, 2018, at 9:32 PM, vwilk@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp wrote: > > > > > > It's May, mid semester in Japan, and how are all of you? > > > > David K. says: "So what is the difference that makes a difference?" > > And it gives me a chance to stick my figurative oar in, saying "them's > > Bateson's words." > > Bateson's definition of "information" in Mind And Nature: A Necessary > > Unity > > is exactly, "Any difference that makes a difference." > > > > Dicing logic fine, working with binaries in organismic systems, > > sometimes creates polarities that polarise > > rather dynamic interaction that produces new avenues of connection. > > > > As always, David's quick take is illuminating, evocative, and > > informative. > > Kind regards, > > Vandy > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > >> Mike makes the point, in an earlier thread, that if we do not > > understand > >> what Pavlov meant by "conditional response"--if, for example, we > > assimilate > >> it to operant conditioning on the one hand or reflexology on the other > > --we > >> do not understand the type of claim that Pavlov was making, nor the > >> position that Pavlov's work takes up in Vygotsky's development. > >> > >> So what is the difference that makes a difference? Pavlov takes the > >> response as given by natural conditions rather than by a conditioned > >> system (e.g. designed and designated rewards and punishments). At the > > same > >> time, Pavlov takes the response as being neurologically ordered rather > > than > >> simply reflexive and mechanical (and so potentially open to explaining > >> language through a "second signal system"). > >> > >> Pavlov is working in a good old Russian interpretation of Darwin which > > was > >> (as Loren Graham points out) a kind of "Through the Looking Glass" > > version > >> of our own. 19th Century America happily accepted the Spencerian > > formula > >> "survival of the fittest" but rejected the mutability of species; > > Russians > >> came to precisely the opposite conclusion (as did Darwin himself). > >> > >> Pavlov sees species as endlessly mutable, and the conditional response > > is > >> part of that infiinite mutability. It includes the possibility of > >> self-mutability--something that, as Vygotsky points out, opens the > > door to > >> a synthesis of Darwin and Lamarck, as far as cultural forms of > > behavior are > >> concerned. > >> > >> At the same time, there is something immutable in Pavlov that Vygotsky > > in > >> turn rejects, Pavlov sees the response as given by nature and the > >> condition as given by nurture, and for Vygotsky this division is too > >> elemental to be interesting in the understanding of cultural forms of > >> behavior: if the condition is both "natural" and "human", then it > > makes no > >> sense to argue that the response is merely the former. A dog that can > > ring > >> its own bell is a very different species indeed. > >> > >> Take, for example, a classroom situation. If we take children's > > responses > >> as conditional, their source is always in the classroom environment > >> (physical punishments, and tangible rewards, the real apple and not > > the > >> apple of the imagination, as Bleuler says). But if we take chlidren's > >> response as conditioned, their source is ultimately the child (the > >> satisfactions of peer recognition, teacher praise, self-praise, or > > simply > >> turning out to have the right answer).There is absolutely nothing > >> preventing the child from emancipating himself or herself from peers, > >> teachers, and even a pre-determined right answer. The continuation of > >> development beyond this point of self-emancipation cannot be explained > > at > >> all. > >> > >> David Kellogg > >> Sangmyung University > >> > >> Recent Article in Language Sciences > >> > >> A science for verbal art: Elizabeth Gaskell's contribution to a > > critique of > >> political economy > >> > >> https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0388000117303534 > >> > >> Fang Li and David Kellogg., > >> > >> https://doi.org/10.1016/j.langsci.2018.05.001 > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > From mcole@ucsd.edu Mon May 21 13:13:34 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Mon, 21 May 2018 13:13:34 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] CHAT on Academia Message-ID: Downloading a paper just now I was surprised by this bit of info: 9,456 papers on Academia discuss "Cultural Historical Activity Theory Research" no accounting for taste! mike -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot From jamesma320@gmail.com Mon May 21 14:13:50 2018 From: jamesma320@gmail.com (James Ma) Date: Mon, 21 May 2018 22:13:50 +0100 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: CHAT on Academia In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Also, in China there has been a surge of interest in CHAT and its connection with Kant and Hegel... James On 21 May 2018 at 21:13, mike cole wrote: > Downloading a paper just now I was surprised by this bit of info: > > 9,456 papers on Academia discuss "Cultural Historical Activity Theory > Research" > > no accounting for taste! > > mike > > > > -- > A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being > masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most > soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. > ---George Eliot > Virus-free. www.avast.com <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> From dkellogg60@gmail.com Mon May 28 17:56:16 2018 From: dkellogg60@gmail.com (David Kellogg) Date: Tue, 29 May 2018 09:56:16 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean Message-ID: The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it has never actually been published in any language except Russian. Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking during concept formation but also why. c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the "intro-volution" of structures. This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our culture. David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180529/822a6a38/attachment.html From mcole@ucsd.edu Mon May 28 18:36:20 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Mon, 28 May 2018 18:36:20 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all look forward to an English edition. All those issues good for discussion. Where does the text on Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional systems- perezhivanie Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? Mike On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg wrote: > The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the > first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see > link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it > has never actually been published in any language except Russian. > > Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French > (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own > importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at > least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. > > a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly > inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at > the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of > everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never > published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. > > b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with > concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in > adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation > in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as > a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking > during concept formation but also why. > > c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky > himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people > who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly > the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. > Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the > "intro-volution" of structures. > > This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's > actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five > chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next > volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last > great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" > of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural > maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens > earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or > her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our > culture. > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community > > Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) > > http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 > > -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180528/e10bb04f/attachment.html From andyb@marxists.org Mon May 28 18:36:22 2018 From: andyb@marxists.org (Andy Blunden) Date: Tue, 29 May 2018 11:36:22 +1000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Couple of questions, David. Which chapter of T&S are you referring to with "the chapter on concept formation in adolescence"? Are you saying that LSV uses the term "semanticization" to mean things like "algebraic symbolism, works of art, writing, schemes, diagrams, maps, blueprints ..."? Andy ------------------------------------------------------------ Andy Blunden http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm On 29/05/2018 10:56 AM, David Kellogg wrote: > The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the > publication of the first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology > of the Adolescent" in Korean (see link below). Some of > this material has been circulated on our list, but it has > never actually been published in any language except Russian. > > Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological > work in French (and, eventually, in English), I think the > material speaks for its own importance in theory and in > methodology. But I also think it addresses (at least) > three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. > > a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks > are utterly inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, > Vygotsky, and even Binet said at the time. So we need > neoformations that are observable in the data of everyday > life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, > never published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at > Thirteen. > > b) What does the child think with before the child is > thinking with concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the > chapter on concept formation in adolescence is actually > placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation in > elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role > of emotion as a "sputnik" of development not only explain > how the adolescent is thinking during concept formation > but also why. > > c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? > Vygotsky himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes > it and says that people who use this are simply > handwaving. This material was written at exactly the point > in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not > use it. Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in > order to describe the "intro-volution" of structures. > > This volume has important things to add on all of these > issues, but it's actually little more than the kind of > preamble we find in the first five chapters of HDHMF or > the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next > volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says > that the last great critical period of childhood is the > product of the "non-coincidence" of general anatomical > growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural maturity. > Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty > happens earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's > ability to reproduce his or her own labor and that of a > family seems to be endlessly put off by our culture. > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community > > Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the > Korean language) > > http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180529/9a02cf75/attachment.html From lsmolucha@hotmail.com Tue May 29 09:20:24 2018 From: lsmolucha@hotmail.com (Larry Smolucha) Date: Tue, 29 May 2018 16:20:24 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: English translation of Pedology of the Adolescent In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Message from Francine: Congratulations to David and his team! Mike mentioned looking forward to an English edition - on that note: Volume 5 of the Collected Works of L.S. Vygotsky (1998) does include an English translation of the Pedology of the Adolescent. But one of the things that puzzled me in 1985, when I translated Chapter 12 Imagination and Creativity of the Adolescent from the Russian text (Pedagogika, 1984) was that the next chapter '13' was missing. If my memory is correct Chapter 12 was followed numerically by Chapter 14. In the 1998 English publication by Plenum this is not obvious because Imagination and Creativity of the Adolescent is labeled Chapter 4. Perhaps, David has some info about the chapter missing from Pedagogika 1984. Was that the Russian text that his team worked from or did they have a much earlier original Russian text? Any obvious differences between the Russian texts? or between the available English translation and the new Korean one? Just wondering. ________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of mike cole Sent: Monday, May 28, 2018 8:36 PM To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all look forward to an English edition. All those issues good for discussion. Where does the text on Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional systems- perezhivanie Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? Mike On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg > wrote: The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it has never actually been published in any language except Russian. Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking during concept formation but also why. c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the "intro-volution" of structures. This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our culture. David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180529/e2148314/attachment.html From a.j.gil@iped.uio.no Tue May 29 13:17:52 2018 From: a.j.gil@iped.uio.no (Alfredo Jornet Gil) Date: Tue, 29 May 2018 20:17:52 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: English translation of Pedology of the Adolescent In-Reply-To: References: , , Message-ID: <1527625071934.62840@iped.uio.no> ?Congratulations David! That is a huge accomplishment. I look forward to hear if you have an answer to Francine. Best, Alfredo Jornet ________________________________ New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full ________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of Larry Smolucha Sent: 29 May 2018 18:20 To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: English translation of Pedology of the Adolescent Message from Francine: Congratulations to David and his team! Mike mentioned looking forward to an English edition - on that note: Volume 5 of the Collected Works of L.S. Vygotsky (1998) does include an English translation of the Pedology of the Adolescent. But one of the things that puzzled me in 1985, when I translated Chapter 12 Imagination and Creativity of the Adolescent from the Russian text (Pedagogika, 1984) was that the next chapter '13' was missing. If my memory is correct Chapter 12 was followed numerically by Chapter 14. In the 1998 English publication by Plenum this is not obvious because Imagination and Creativity of the Adolescent is labeled Chapter 4. Perhaps, David has some info about the chapter missing from Pedagogika 1984. Was that the Russian text that his team worked from or did they have a much earlier original Russian text? Any obvious differences between the Russian texts? or between the available English translation and the new Korean one? Just wondering. ________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of mike cole Sent: Monday, May 28, 2018 8:36 PM To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all look forward to an English edition. All those issues good for discussion. Where does the text on Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional systems- perezhivanie Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? Mike On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg > wrote: The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it has never actually been published in any language except Russian. Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking during concept formation but also why. c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the "intro-volution" of structures. This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our culture. David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180529/f655c503/attachment.html From dkellogg60@gmail.com Tue May 29 14:16:16 2018 From: dkellogg60@gmail.com (David Kellogg) Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 06:16:16 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Andy--You remember that Chapter Five of T&S was taken from "Pedology of the Adolescent". The note which Van der Veer and Valsiner append to the full, "Pedology of the Adolescent" version on p. 262 of the Vygotsky Reader is a little misleading: they say that "Pedology of the Adolescent" is lopsided and that other chapters "totalled" a meagre 15 pages.This makes it sound like the bulk of Pedology of the Adolescent is Chapter Five. In fact the other Chapters---there are sixteen of them--are almost all of the same length, so in fact Chapter Five is only a small part of the work. What Francine says about the Pedology of the Adolescent in Volume Five of the Collected Works has to be read with that great length in mind--as she says, there is a small part of it translated in Volume Five. We also translated the chapter on imagination and creativity in the adolescent as an addendum to the book we did on Imagination and Creativity in Childhood, for which Francine wrote us a very nice jacket blurb. Volume Five has only extracts from five of the sixteen chapters; concepts are disproportionately represented, and there isn't a word about sexual maturation and love, to which Vygotsky actually devotes two whole chapters in the massive, two volume version he published as a correspondence course when he was working at Moscow Second State University. It is this full length version,w hich is not at all lopsided, that we are publishing, and we estimate there will be another two volumes in addition to this one. We also added material from the"Lectures on Pedology" pertaining to the Crisis at Thirteen. This is the material I circulated earlier on this list. Most of work is, however, not translated into English. Nikolai Veresov and I are working to bring out a version in English for Springer, but it won't be out for a few years. In the Chapter on the Crisis at Seven and the Crisis at Thirteen in "Lectures on Pedology" Vygotsky refers to the central neoformation of the Crisis at Three as "semanticized perception" and compares it to the central neoformation of the Crisis at Seven, "semanticized perezhivanie". The neoformation of Early Childhood, that is, the stable outcome of the Crisis at One in which "autonomous" speech is constructed and then adult language is construed, is "systemic and semantically structure of consciousness" (?????????? ? ?????????? ???????? ????????). To me this is the solution of the question Vygotsky asks at the end of Chapter Two in HDHMF, where he rejects the use of the term "psychological tools". A tool is used to act on objects, not on a subject. The things you name--algebraic symbols, blueprints, writing--are all forms of language when they act on subjects, and they are only tools when they transform the environment (e.g. a blue print is only a tool when it is turned into a building, and writing is only a tool when it is etched into the side of a monument). Voloshinov makes the same point: when we look at the handle of an axe, we sometimes see that it is decorated with patterns and sometimes not: this in itself tells us that the axe is essentially a tool and only accidentally a vehicle for signs. The problem with the phrase "psychological tools" is the reverse one: it takes artifacts like algebraic symbols, blueprints and writing which are essentially signs and only accidentally tools and declares them all to be essentially tools. dk David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 On Tue, May 29, 2018 at 10:36 AM, Andy Blunden wrote: > Couple of questions, David. > > Which chapter of T&S are you referring to with "the chapter on concept > formation in adolescence"? > > Are you saying that LSV uses the term "semanticization" to mean things > like "algebraic symbolism, works of art, writing, schemes, diagrams, > maps, blueprints ..."? > > Andy > ------------------------------ > Andy Blunden > http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm > On 29/05/2018 10:56 AM, David Kellogg wrote: > > The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the > first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see > link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it > has never actually been published in any language except Russian. > > Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French > (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own > importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at > least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. > > a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly > inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at > the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of > everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never > published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. > > b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with > concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in > adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation > in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as > a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking > during concept formation but also why. > > c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky > himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people > who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly > the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. > Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the > "intro-volution" of structures. > > This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's > actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five > chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next > volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last > great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" > of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural > maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens > earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or > her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our > culture. > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community > > Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) > > http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180530/6bf052c7/attachment.html From dkellogg60@gmail.com Tue May 29 14:54:16 2018 From: dkellogg60@gmail.com (David Kellogg) Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 06:54:16 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: English translation of Pedology of the Adolescent In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Francine: Vygotsky has said that he will tackle the problem of adolescence holistically: the first part is a general introduction, the second has to do with general anatomical growth and sexual maturation, the third part is psychology, and the fourth part is social problems of the transitional age. The Russian Collected Works selects only four chapters from the third part, which is the first part of the second volume of the original correspondence course. This first part of the second volume is devoted to the psychology of the adolescent. The editors say that they are only including those parts of the book which are concerned with psychology (because Volume Four of the Russian CW, which is Volume Five of the English, is entitled Child Psychology. They do include Vygotsky's final conclusion though, which is Chapter Sixteen, "Dynamics and Structure of the Adolescent Personality". They omit the whole section on social problems of the pedology of the transitional age: Chapter 13: Choice of a Professioin Chapter 14: Social Behavior of the Adolescent Chapter 15: The Working Adolescent . As you say, the English CW gets around this by renumbering the extracts. But the entire first part, which is the part we are now publishing, is omitted, and even the parts that are included in the Russian CW and subsequently the English CW have been heavily edited. David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 1:20 AM, Larry Smolucha wrote: > Message from Francine: > > > Congratulations to David and his team! > > > Mike mentioned looking forward to an English edition - on that note: > > Volume 5 of the Collected Works of L.S. Vygotsky (1998) does include > an English translation of the Pedology of the Adolescent. > > > But one of the things that puzzled me in 1985, when I translated Chapter > 12 *Imagination and Creativity of the Adolescent* from the Russian text > (Pedagogika, 1984) was that the next chapter '13' was missing. If my > memory is correct Chapter 12 was followed numerically by Chapter 14. In the > 1998 English publication by Plenum this is not obvious because Imagination > and Creativity of the Adolescent is labeled Chapter 4. > > > Perhaps, David has some info about the chapter missing from Pedagogika > 1984. > > Was that the Russian text that his team worked from or did they have a > much earlier original Russian text? Any obvious differences between the > Russian texts? or between the available English translation and the new > Korean one? > > > Just wondering. > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu > on behalf of mike cole > *Sent:* Monday, May 28, 2018 8:36 PM > *To:* eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > *Subject:* [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent > Published in Korean > > Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all look forward to an > English edition. > > All those issues good for discussion. > Where does the text on > Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional systems- perezhivanie > Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? > > Mike > > On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg > wrote: > > The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the > first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see > link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it > has never actually been published in any language except Russian. > > Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French > (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own > importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at > least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. > > a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly > inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at > the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of > everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never > published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. > > b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with > concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in > adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation > in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as > a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking > during concept formation but also why. > > c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky > himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people > who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly > the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. > Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the > "intro-volution" of structures. > > This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's > actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five > chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next > volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last > great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" > of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural > maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens > earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or > her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our > culture. > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community > > Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) > > http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 > > > -- > A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being > masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most > soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. > ---George Eliot > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180530/24bbc595/attachment.html From jgregmcverry@gmail.com Wed May 30 13:08:11 2018 From: jgregmcverry@gmail.com (Greg Mcverry) Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 16:08:11 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Looking for Reading on Stages of Reading Development Message-ID: Hello all I am teaching an intro to early lit class to students new to our teacher ed program. We cover stages of Reading with a strong Chall flavor. I am looking for another entry level reading from a more socio-cultural perspective. Any tips, Greg -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180530/a01a5a69/attachment.html From jgregmcverry@gmail.com Wed May 30 13:08:11 2018 From: jgregmcverry@gmail.com (Greg Mcverry) Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 16:08:11 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Looking for Reading on Stages of Reading Development Message-ID: Hello all I am teaching an intro to early lit class to students new to our teacher ed program. We cover stages of Reading with a strong Chall flavor. I am looking for another entry level reading from a more socio-cultural perspective. Any tips, Greg -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180530/a01a5a69/attachment-0001.html From mcole@ucsd.edu Wed May 30 16:10:02 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 16:10:02 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Looking for Reading on Stages of Reading Development In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Here are a couple of papers on literacy, Greg I have a few papers on our earlier work on acquisition of reading. The first link below is a long, detailed draft of a paper that was only published in full in Russian). It goes beyond Chall in a way you might find interesting. The second is a paper sort of explaining the link between still earlier cross-cultural that contains a cut down version of the long unpublished piece. The last one another short, somewhat different, piece on the topic of acquisition of reading. Contact me directly if you want to follow up. We are particularly focused on a critique of "level one --> level 2 theories" (with respect to acquisition of literacy, decoding before comprehension) and try to offer an empirically grounded alternative. mike http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/NEWTECHN.pdf http://quote.ucsd.edu/lchcautobio/files/2015/08/Cole-1995-Culture-and-Cognitive-Development-PDF.pdf http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/MCole/ColeGriffinRemediation.pdf On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Greg Mcverry wrote: > Hello all I am teaching an intro to early lit class to students new to our > teacher ed program. > > We cover stages of Reading with a strong Chall flavor. I am looking for > another entry level reading from a more socio-cultural perspective. > > Any tips, > Greg > -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180530/08d74ed4/attachment.html From mcole@ucsd.edu Wed May 30 16:10:02 2018 From: mcole@ucsd.edu (mike cole) Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 16:10:02 -0700 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Looking for Reading on Stages of Reading Development In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Here are a couple of papers on literacy, Greg I have a few papers on our earlier work on acquisition of reading. The first link below is a long, detailed draft of a paper that was only published in full in Russian). It goes beyond Chall in a way you might find interesting. The second is a paper sort of explaining the link between still earlier cross-cultural that contains a cut down version of the long unpublished piece. The last one another short, somewhat different, piece on the topic of acquisition of reading. Contact me directly if you want to follow up. We are particularly focused on a critique of "level one --> level 2 theories" (with respect to acquisition of literacy, decoding before comprehension) and try to offer an empirically grounded alternative. mike http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/NEWTECHN.pdf http://quote.ucsd.edu/lchcautobio/files/2015/08/Cole-1995-Culture-and-Cognitive-Development-PDF.pdf http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/MCole/ColeGriffinRemediation.pdf On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Greg Mcverry wrote: > Hello all I am teaching an intro to early lit class to students new to our > teacher ed program. > > We cover stages of Reading with a strong Chall flavor. I am looking for > another entry level reading from a more socio-cultural perspective. > > Any tips, > Greg > -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180530/08d74ed4/attachment-0001.html From dkellogg60@gmail.com Wed May 30 18:10:51 2018 From: dkellogg60@gmail.com (David Kellogg) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 10:10:51 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mike: You know, the weird thing is that Vygotsky makes exactly your point about his own development and those of his colleagues in the author's preface to T&S. He says that they had to discard a good deal of material which seemed completely erroneous, and they went down several rabbit holes that turned out to be dead ends.. I find this weird for two reasons. First of all, I have always thought that the periodization of Vygotsky's thinking is overblown (e.g. Minick's preface to T&S in he CW and also in the Intro to Vygotsky volume edited by Daniels). When we look back at the "instrumental" period (a term Luria uses but Vygotsky himself eschews in his letters) and on the "psychological systems" paper, we can see that the rudiments of important ideas in the pedology. "Instrumental" psychology becomes the Social Situation of Development conceptualized as a relation between the child and the environment rather than a material setting on which the child acts wiht instruments. The "psychological system of functions" is a rudimentary form of the idea of a Central Neoformation and a Central Line of Development which exchanges places with Peripheral Neoformations and Peripheral Lines of Development. So it sees to me that the three different Vygotskies discovered by Minick and Gonzalez Rey and others are really artifacts of what happened after Vygotsky's death; there is one Vygotsky, and the key to the anatomy of "Ape, Primtive, Child" is in the anatomy of the pedology. Secondly, although Vygotsky does say this about discarding a good deal of material and going down rabbit holes that turned out to be dead ends, there is this weird problem with Chapter Five. It is, very clearly and evidently, about adolescents, and its main argument is that concepts do not and cannot emerge until after the Crisis at Thirteen. And yet the very next chapter, Chapter Six, is equally clearly and equally evidently about school children, and its main argument is that the complexes need to be left, like Mary's Little Lamb, at the school door. One of these chapters must be a rabbit hole that turned out to be a dead end. But which one? dk David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 On Tue, May 29, 2018 at 10:36 AM, mike cole wrote: > Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all look forward to an > English edition. > > All those issues good for discussion. > Where does the text on > Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional systems- perezhivanie > Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? > > Mike > > On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg > wrote: > >> The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the >> first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see >> link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it >> has never actually been published in any language except Russian. >> >> Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French >> (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own >> importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at >> least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. >> >> a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly >> inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at >> the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of >> everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never >> published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. >> >> b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with >> concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in >> adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation >> in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as >> a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking >> during concept formation but also why. >> >> c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky >> himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people >> who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly >> the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. >> Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the >> "intro-volution" of structures. >> >> This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's >> actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five >> chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next >> volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last >> great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" >> of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural >> maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens >> earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or >> her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our >> culture. >> >> David Kellogg >> Sangmyung University >> >> New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community >> >> Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) >> >> http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 >> >> > -- > A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being > masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most > soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. > ---George Eliot > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/7b9a5d06/attachment.html From andyb@marxists.org Wed May 30 19:09:40 2018 From: andyb@marxists.org (Andy Blunden) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 12:09:40 +1000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3a407da7-ea1d-da4d-08d0-2ea4e2dba66b@marxists.org> David, you keep talking about "Chapter 5" but you never specify of which book. Could you help me out here. Which text are we talking about? Andy ------------------------------------------------------------ Andy Blunden http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm On 31/05/2018 11:10 AM, David Kellogg wrote: > Mike: > > You know, the weird thing is that Vygotsky makes exactly > your point about his own development and those of his > colleagues in the author's preface to T&S. He says that > they had to discard a good deal of material which seemed > completely erroneous, and they went down several rabbit > holes that turned out to be dead ends.. > > I find this weird for two reasons. First of all, I have > always thought that the periodization of Vygotsky's > thinking is overblown (e.g. Minick's preface to T&S in he > CW and also in the Intro to Vygotsky volume edited by > Daniels). When we look back at the "instrumental" period > (a term Luria uses but Vygotsky himself eschews in his > letters) and on the "psychological systems" paper, we can > see that the rudiments of important ideas in the pedology. > "Instrumental" psychology becomes the Social Situation of > Development conceptualized as a relation between the child > and the environment rather than a material setting on > which the child acts wiht instruments. The "psychological > system of functions" is a rudimentary form of the idea of > a Central Neoformation and a Central Line of Development > which exchanges places with Peripheral Neoformations and > Peripheral Lines of Development. So it sees to me that the > three different Vygotskies discovered by Minick and > Gonzalez Rey and others are really artifacts of what > happened after Vygotsky's death; there is one Vygotsky, > and the key to the anatomy of "Ape, Primtive, Child" is in > the anatomy of the pedology. > > Secondly, although Vygotsky does say this about discarding > a good deal of material and going down rabbit holes that > turned out to be dead ends, there is this weird problem > with Chapter Five. It is, very clearly and evidently, > about adolescents, and its main argument is that concepts > do not and cannot emerge until after the Crisis at > Thirteen. And yet the very next chapter, Chapter Six, is > equally clearly and equally evidently about school > children, and its main argument is that the complexes need > to be left, like Mary's Little Lamb, at the school door. > One of these chapters must be a rabbit hole that turned > out to be a dead end. But which one? > > dk > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community > > Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the > Korean language) > > http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 > > > On Tue, May 29, 2018 at 10:36 AM, mike cole > > wrote: > > Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all look > forward to an English edition. > > All those issues good for discussion. > Where does the text on > Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional systems- > perezhivanie > Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? > > Mike > > On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg > > > wrote: > > The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce > the publication of the first volume of Vygotsky's > "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see link > below). Some of this material has been circulated > on our list, but it has never actually been > published in any language except Russian. > > Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's > pedological work in French (and, eventually, in > English), I think the material speaks for its own > importance in theory and in methodology. But I > also think it addresses (at least) three practical > questions which keep coming up on this list. > > a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet > tasks are utterly inadequate for this purpose, as > Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at the > time. So we need neoformations that are observable > in the data of everyday life, e.g. language. The > first chapter of this volume, never published in > Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. > > b) What does the child think with before the child > is thinking with concepts? In Thinking and Speech, > the chapter on concept formation in adolescence is > actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept > formation in elementary school. The chapters in > this volume on the role of emotion as a "sputnik" > of development not only explain how the adolescent > is thinking during concept formation but also why. > > c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological > tools"? Vygotsky himself uses it at one point. > Then he criticizes it and says that people who use > this are simply handwaving. This material was > written at exactly the point in his thinking he > made that criticism, and...he does not use it. > Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in > order to describe the "intro-volution" of structures. > > This volume has important things to add on all of > these issues, but it's actually little more than > the kind of preamble we find in the first five > chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we > find in T&S. In the next volume, which we are > working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last > great critical period of childhood is the product > of the "non-coincidence" of general anatomical > growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural > maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to > diet), puberty happens earlier and earlier > (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his > or her own labor and that of a family seems to be > endlessly put off by our culture. > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community > > Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? > (in the Korean language) > > http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 > > > > -- > A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the > advantage of being > masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher > kind than the most > soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder > quality. > ---George Eliot > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/10bf8612/attachment.html From dkellogg60@gmail.com Wed May 30 19:24:09 2018 From: dkellogg60@gmail.com (David Kellogg) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 11:24:09 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean In-Reply-To: <3a407da7-ea1d-da4d-08d0-2ea4e2dba66b@marxists.org> References: <3a407da7-ea1d-da4d-08d0-2ea4e2dba66b@marxists.org> Message-ID: Come on, Andy. Take a look at the VERY FIRST LINE of my response to you yesterday. dk David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 On Thu, May 31, 2018 at 11:09 AM, Andy Blunden wrote: > David, you keep talking about "Chapter 5" but you never specify of which > book. Could you help me out here. Which text are we talking about? > > Andy > ------------------------------ > Andy Blunden > http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm > On 31/05/2018 11:10 AM, David Kellogg wrote: > > Mike: > > You know, the weird thing is that Vygotsky makes exactly your point about > his own development and those of his colleagues in the author's preface to > T&S. He says that they had to discard a good deal of material which seemed > completely erroneous, and they went down several rabbit holes that turned > out to be dead ends.. > > I find this weird for two reasons. First of all, I have always thought > that the periodization of Vygotsky's thinking is overblown (e.g. Minick's > preface to T&S in he CW and also in the Intro to Vygotsky volume edited by > Daniels). When we look back at the "instrumental" period (a term Luria uses > but Vygotsky himself eschews in his letters) and on the "psychological > systems" paper, we can see that the rudiments of important ideas in the > pedology. "Instrumental" psychology becomes the Social Situation of > Development conceptualized as a relation between the child and the > environment rather than a material setting on which the child acts wiht > instruments. The "psychological system of functions" is a rudimentary form > of the idea of a Central Neoformation and a Central Line of Development > which exchanges places with Peripheral Neoformations and Peripheral Lines > of Development. So it sees to me that the three different Vygotskies > discovered by Minick and Gonzalez Rey and others are really artifacts of > what happened after Vygotsky's death; there is one Vygotsky, and the key to > the anatomy of "Ape, Primtive, Child" is in the anatomy of the pedology. > > Secondly, although Vygotsky does say this about discarding a good deal of > material and going down rabbit holes that turned out to be dead ends, there > is this weird problem with Chapter Five. It is, very clearly and evidently, > about adolescents, and its main argument is that concepts do not and cannot > emerge until after the Crisis at Thirteen. And yet the very next chapter, > Chapter Six, is equally clearly and equally evidently about school > children, and its main argument is that the complexes need to be left, like > Mary's Little Lamb, at the school door. One of these chapters must be a > rabbit hole that turned out to be a dead end. But which one? > > dk > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community > > Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) > > http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 > > > On Tue, May 29, 2018 at 10:36 AM, mike cole wrote: > >> Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all look forward to an >> English edition. >> >> All those issues good for discussion. >> Where does the text on >> Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional systems- perezhivanie >> Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? >> >> Mike >> >> On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg < >> dkellogg60@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the >>> first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see >>> link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it >>> has never actually been published in any language except Russian. >>> >>> Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French >>> (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own >>> importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at >>> least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. >>> >>> a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly >>> inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at >>> the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of >>> everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never >>> published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. >>> >>> b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with >>> concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in >>> adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation >>> in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as >>> a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking >>> during concept formation but also why. >>> >>> c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky >>> himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people >>> who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly >>> the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. >>> Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the >>> "intro-volution" of structures. >>> >>> This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's >>> actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five >>> chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next >>> volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last >>> great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" >>> of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural >>> maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens >>> earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or >>> her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our >>> culture. >>> >>> David Kellogg >>> Sangmyung University >>> >>> New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community >>> >>> Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) >>> >>> http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 >>> >>> >> -- >> A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being >> masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most >> soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. >> ---George Eliot >> > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/24ba3461/attachment.html From andyb@marxists.org Wed May 30 19:26:58 2018 From: andyb@marxists.org (Andy Blunden) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 12:26:58 +1000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean In-Reply-To: References: <3a407da7-ea1d-da4d-08d0-2ea4e2dba66b@marxists.org> Message-ID: <981acf85-4b7c-eda7-aaa5-23bcbeb3766c@marxists.org> Thanks, David. Andy ------------------------------------------------------------ Andy Blunden http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm On 31/05/2018 12:24 PM, David Kellogg wrote: > Come on, Andy. Take a look at the VERY FIRST LINE of my > response to you yesterday. > > dk > > David Kellogg > Sangmyung University > > New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community > > Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the > Korean language) > > http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 > > > On Thu, May 31, 2018 at 11:09 AM, Andy Blunden > > wrote: > > David, you keep talking about "Chapter 5" but you > never specify of which book. Could you help me out > here. Which text are we talking about? > > Andy > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > Andy Blunden > http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm > > On 31/05/2018 11:10 AM, David Kellogg wrote: >> Mike: >> >> You know, the weird thing is that Vygotsky makes >> exactly your point about his own development and >> those of his colleagues in the author's preface to >> T&S. He says that they had to discard a good deal of >> material which seemed completely erroneous, and they >> went down several rabbit holes that turned out to be >> dead ends.. >> >> I find this weird for two reasons. First of all, I >> have always thought that the periodization of >> Vygotsky's thinking is overblown (e.g. Minick's >> preface to T&S in he CW and also in the Intro to >> Vygotsky volume edited by Daniels). When we look back >> at the "instrumental" period (a term Luria uses but >> Vygotsky himself eschews in his letters) and on the >> "psychological systems" paper, we can see that the >> rudiments of important ideas in the pedology. >> "Instrumental" psychology becomes the Social >> Situation of Development conceptualized as a relation >> between the child and the environment rather than a >> material setting on which the child acts wiht >> instruments. The "psychological system of functions" >> is a rudimentary form of the idea of a Central >> Neoformation and a Central Line of Development which >> exchanges places with Peripheral Neoformations and >> Peripheral Lines of Development. So it sees to me >> that the three different Vygotskies discovered by >> Minick and Gonzalez Rey and others are really >> artifacts of what happened after Vygotsky's death; >> there is one Vygotsky, and the key to the anatomy of >> "Ape, Primtive, Child" is in the anatomy of the >> pedology. >> >> Secondly, although Vygotsky does say this about >> discarding a good deal of material and going down >> rabbit holes that turned out to be dead ends, there >> is this weird problem with Chapter Five. It is, very >> clearly and evidently, about adolescents, and its >> main argument is that concepts do not and cannot >> emerge until after the Crisis at Thirteen. And yet >> the very next chapter, Chapter Six, is equally >> clearly and equally evidently about school children, >> and its main argument is that the complexes need to >> be left, like Mary's Little Lamb, at the school door. >> One of these chapters must be a rabbit hole that >> turned out to be a dead end. But which one? >> >> dk >> >> David Kellogg >> Sangmyung University >> >> New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community >> >> Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in >> the Korean language) >> >> http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 >> >> >> >> On Tue, May 29, 2018 at 10:36 AM, mike cole >> > wrote: >> >> Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all >> look forward to an English edition. >> >> All those issues good for discussion. >> Where does the text on >> Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional >> systems- perezhivanie >> Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? >> >> Mike >> >> On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg >> > > wrote: >> >> The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to >> announce the publication of the first volume >> of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" >> in Korean (see link below). Some of this >> material has been circulated on our list, but >> it has never actually been published in any >> language except Russian. >> >> Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's >> pedological work in French (and, eventually, >> in English), I think the material speaks for >> its own importance in theory and in >> methodology. But I also think it addresses >> (at least) three practical questions which >> keep coming up on this list. >> >> a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The >> Binet tasks are utterly inadequate for this >> purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even >> Binet said at the time. So we need >> neoformations that are observable in the data >> of everyday life, e.g. language. The first >> chapter of this volume, never published in >> Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. >> >> b) What does the child think with before the >> child is thinking with concepts? In Thinking >> and Speech, the chapter on concept formation >> in adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the >> chapter on preconcept formation in elementary >> school. The chapters in this volume on the >> role of emotion as a "sputnik" of development >> not only explain how the adolescent is >> thinking during concept formation but also why. >> >> c) What is the status of the phrase >> "psychological tools"? Vygotsky himself uses >> it at one point. Then he criticizes it and >> says that people who use this are simply >> handwaving. This material was written at >> exactly the point in his thinking he made >> that criticism, and...he does not use it. >> Instead, he uses the idea of >> "semanticization" in order to describe the >> "intro-volution" of structures. >> >> This volume has important things to add on >> all of these issues, but it's actually little >> more than the kind of preamble we find in the >> first five chapters of HDHMF or the first >> four chapters we find in T&S. In the next >> volume, which we are working on right now, >> Vygotsky says that the last great critical >> period of childhood is the product of the >> "non-coincidence" of general anatomical >> growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural >> maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks >> to diet), puberty happens earlier and earlier >> (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce >> his or her own labor and that of a family >> seems to be endlessly put off by our culture. >> >> David Kellogg >> Sangmyung University >> >> New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community >> >> Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? >> ?? (in the Korean language) >> >> http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 >> >> >> >> -- >> A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the >> advantage of being >> masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a >> higher kind than the most >> soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a >> sounder quality. >> ---George Eliot >> >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/564d66a4/attachment.html From lsmolucha@hotmail.com Wed May 30 21:04:26 2018 From: lsmolucha@hotmail.com (Larry Smolucha) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 04:04:26 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: English translation of Pedology of the Adolescent In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Message from Francine: David thank you for the exposition on how the Pedology of the Adolescent has come down to us over the years. It should be available in English for its centennial (2031). ________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of David Kellogg Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2018 4:54 PM To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: English translation of Pedology of the Adolescent Francine: Vygotsky has said that he will tackle the problem of adolescence holistically: the first part is a general introduction, the second has to do with general anatomical growth and sexual maturation, the third part is psychology, and the fourth part is social problems of the transitional age. The Russian Collected Works selects only four chapters from the third part, which is the first part of the second volume of the original correspondence course. This first part of the second volume is devoted to the psychology of the adolescent. The editors say that they are only including those parts of the book which are concerned with psychology (because Volume Four of the Russian CW, which is Volume Five of the English, is entitled Child Psychology. They do include Vygotsky's final conclusion though, which is Chapter Sixteen, "Dynamics and Structure of the Adolescent Personality". They omit the whole section on social problems of the pedology of the transitional age: Chapter 13: Choice of a Professioin Chapter 14: Social Behavior of the Adolescent Chapter 15: The Working Adolescent . As you say, the English CW gets around this by renumbering the extracts. But the entire first part, which is the part we are now publishing, is omitted, and even the parts that are included in the Russian CW and subsequently the English CW have been heavily edited. David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 [http://image.aladin.co.kr/product/14824/1/cover/k492532351_1.jpg] ??? ?? - ???? ??? ??? ?? 1 www.aladin.co.kr ???? ?? 9?. ???? ?????? ?? ??? ?? ??? ????. ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ?? ??? ??? ???? ?????, ??? ??? ???? ??????? ??. ???... On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 1:20 AM, Larry Smolucha > wrote: Message from Francine: Congratulations to David and his team! Mike mentioned looking forward to an English edition - on that note: Volume 5 of the Collected Works of L.S. Vygotsky (1998) does include an English translation of the Pedology of the Adolescent. But one of the things that puzzled me in 1985, when I translated Chapter 12 Imagination and Creativity of the Adolescent from the Russian text (Pedagogika, 1984) was that the next chapter '13' was missing. If my memory is correct Chapter 12 was followed numerically by Chapter 14. In the 1998 English publication by Plenum this is not obvious because Imagination and Creativity of the Adolescent is labeled Chapter 4. Perhaps, David has some info about the chapter missing from Pedagogika 1984. Was that the Russian text that his team worked from or did they have a much earlier original Russian text? Any obvious differences between the Russian texts? or between the available English translation and the new Korean one? Just wondering. ________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu > on behalf of mike cole > Sent: Monday, May 28, 2018 8:36 PM To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Volume One of Pedology of the Adolescent Published in Korean Congratulions to you and your team, David. We all look forward to an English edition. All those issues good for discussion. Where does the text on Pedology fit in the instrumental? functional systems- perezhivanie Sequencing of his phases of theorizing? Mike On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 6:00 PM David Kellogg > wrote: The Seoul Vygotsky Community is proud to announce the publication of the first volume of Vygotsky's "Pedology of the Adolescent" in Korean (see link below). Some of this material has been circulated on our list, but it has never actually been published in any language except Russian. Like the upcoming publication of Vygotsky's pedological work in French (and, eventually, in English), I think the material speaks for its own importance in theory and in methodology. But I also think it addresses (at least) three practical questions which keep coming up on this list. a) How can a Zoped be measured in years? The Binet tasks are utterly inadequate for this purpose, as Thorndike, Vygotsky, and even Binet said at the time. So we need neoformations that are observable in the data of everyday life, e.g. language. The first chapter of this volume, never published in Engliish, gives these for the Crisis at Thirteen. b) What does the child think with before the child is thinking with concepts? In Thinking and Speech, the chapter on concept formation in adolescence is actually placed BEFORE the chapter on preconcept formation in elementary school. The chapters in this volume on the role of emotion as a "sputnik" of development not only explain how the adolescent is thinking during concept formation but also why. c) What is the status of the phrase "psychological tools"? Vygotsky himself uses it at one point. Then he criticizes it and says that people who use this are simply handwaving. This material was written at exactly the point in his thinking he made that criticism, and...he does not use it. Instead, he uses the idea of "semanticization" in order to describe the "intro-volution" of structures. This volume has important things to add on all of these issues, but it's actually little more than the kind of preamble we find in the first five chapters of HDHMF or the first four chapters we find in T&S. In the next volume, which we are working on right now, Vygotsky says that the last great critical period of childhood is the product of the "non-coincidence" of general anatomical growth, sexual maturation, and socio-cultural maturity. Growth goes on a bit later (thanks to diet), puberty happens earlier and earlier (ditto), but the child's ability to reproduce his or her own labor and that of a family seems to be endlessly put off by our culture. David Kellogg Sangmyung University New Book with the Seoul Vygotsky Community Volume 1 of "Pedology of the Adolescent", ??? ?? (in the Korean language) http://www.aladin.co.kr/shop/wproduct.aspx?ItemId=148240197 -- A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/4d045362/attachment.html From arturo.escandon@gmail.com Wed May 30 23:51:30 2018 From: arturo.escandon@gmail.com (Arturo Escandon) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 15:51:30 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] =?utf-8?q?Filosof=C3=ADa_de_la_ense=C3=B1anza_de_lenguas_extranj?= =?utf-8?q?eras_=28a_primer_on_CHAT_SCT=29?= Message-ID: Hi everyone, I just published a week ago a primer on teaching/learning foreign languages from a dialectic tradition perspective (Hegel, Marx, Vygotsky, etc.). Having the form of an essay, it aims at introducing the dialectic tradition to language teachers. It is part of a project I am working on right now to create groups of Spanish teachers able to work within the CHAT framework, especially in Japan We have so much material in English but so little in Spanish. That is another reason why I wrote it in Spanish. I hope Spanish readers find it useful. http://liberaspress.org/fundamentos/filosofiaensenanza/ All the best, Arturo Arturo Escand?n, PhD Professor of Foreign Language Education Department of Spanish and Latin American Studies Nanzan University 18 Yamazato-cho, Showa-ku Nagoya, 466-8673 JAPAN Tel: +81 (52) 832 3111 (extension 3604) Mobile: +81 (908) 796 4220 E-mail: escandon@nanzan-u.ac.jp -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/24993503/attachment.html From a.j.gil@iped.uio.no Thu May 31 11:32:00 2018 From: a.j.gil@iped.uio.no (Alfredo Jornet Gil) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 18:32:00 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: =?iso-8859-1?q?Filosof=EDa_de_la_ense=F1anza_de_lenguas_extra?= =?iso-8859-1?q?njeras_=28a_primer_on_CHAT_SCT=29?= In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1527791520387.27908@iped.uio.no> Congratulations for your publication Arturo. I am so disconnected from Spanish academic literature that I must admit I have no idea which resources are there for those who work within CHAT frameworks. Surely a great resource for many on this list and outside it. ? Un abrazo y mucha suerte con tu proyecto, Alfredo Jornet ________________________________ New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full ________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of Arturo Escandon Sent: 31 May 2018 08:51 To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Filosof?a de la ense?anza de lenguas extranjeras (a primer on CHAT SCT) Hi everyone, I just published a week ago a primer on teaching/learning foreign languages from a dialectic tradition perspective (Hegel, Marx, Vygotsky, etc.). Having the form of an essay, it aims at introducing the dialectic tradition to language teachers. It is part of a project I am working on right now to create groups of Spanish teachers able to work within the CHAT framework, especially in Japan We have so much material in English but so little in Spanish. That is another reason why I wrote it in Spanish. I hope Spanish readers find it useful. http://liberaspress.org/fundamentos/filosofiaensenanza/ All the best, Arturo Arturo Escand?n, PhD Professor of Foreign Language Education Department of Spanish and Latin American Studies Nanzan University 18 Yamazato-cho, Showa-ku Nagoya, 466-8673 JAPAN Tel: +81 (52) 832 3111 (extension 3604) Mobile: +81 (908) 796 4220 E-mail: escandon@nanzan-u.ac.jp -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/14baf8a4/attachment.html From a.j.gil@iped.uio.no Thu May 31 11:32:00 2018 From: a.j.gil@iped.uio.no (Alfredo Jornet Gil) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 18:32:00 +0000 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: =?iso-8859-1?q?Filosof=EDa_de_la_ense=F1anza_de_lenguas_extra?= =?iso-8859-1?q?njeras_=28a_primer_on_CHAT_SCT=29?= In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1527791520387.27908@iped.uio.no> Congratulations for your publication Arturo. I am so disconnected from Spanish academic literature that I must admit I have no idea which resources are there for those who work within CHAT frameworks. Surely a great resource for many on this list and outside it. ? Un abrazo y mucha suerte con tu proyecto, Alfredo Jornet ________________________________ New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full ________________________________ From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu on behalf of Arturo Escandon Sent: 31 May 2018 08:51 To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity Subject: [Xmca-l] Filosof?a de la ense?anza de lenguas extranjeras (a primer on CHAT SCT) Hi everyone, I just published a week ago a primer on teaching/learning foreign languages from a dialectic tradition perspective (Hegel, Marx, Vygotsky, etc.). Having the form of an essay, it aims at introducing the dialectic tradition to language teachers. It is part of a project I am working on right now to create groups of Spanish teachers able to work within the CHAT framework, especially in Japan We have so much material in English but so little in Spanish. That is another reason why I wrote it in Spanish. I hope Spanish readers find it useful. http://liberaspress.org/fundamentos/filosofiaensenanza/ All the best, Arturo Arturo Escand?n, PhD Professor of Foreign Language Education Department of Spanish and Latin American Studies Nanzan University 18 Yamazato-cho, Showa-ku Nagoya, 466-8673 JAPAN Tel: +81 (52) 832 3111 (extension 3604) Mobile: +81 (908) 796 4220 E-mail: escandon@nanzan-u.ac.jp -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/14baf8a4/attachment-0001.html From jgregmcverry@gmail.com Thu May 31 12:07:56 2018 From: jgregmcverry@gmail.com (Greg Mcverry) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 15:07:56 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Looking for Reading on Stages of Reading Development In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I know and I thank you for sharing these. iw ill share with my students. I went with Hull, G & Moje E. (nd). What is the Development of Literacy the Development Of?. Understanding Language In a pinch. Here is the module: http://edu305.jgregorymcverry.com/modulefour.html Apologize for the huge splash image trying to learn CSS Grid to make an easy remixable course template for faculty. On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 7:12 PM mike cole wrote: > Here are a couple of papers on literacy, Greg > > I have a few papers on our earlier work on acquisition of reading. The > first link below is a long, detailed draft of a paper that was only > published in full in Russian). It goes beyond Chall in a way you might find > interesting. The second is a paper sort of explaining the link between > still earlier cross-cultural that contains a cut down version of the long > unpublished piece. The last one another short, somewhat different, piece on > the topic of acquisition of reading. > > Contact me directly if you want to follow up. We are particularly focused > on a critique of "level one --> level 2 theories" (with respect to > acquisition of literacy, decoding before comprehension) and try to offer an > empirically grounded alternative. > mike > > http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/NEWTECHN.pdf > > > http://quote.ucsd.edu/lchcautobio/files/2015/08/Cole-1995-Culture-and-Cognitive-Development-PDF.pdf > > http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/MCole/ColeGriffinRemediation.pdf > > > > On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Greg Mcverry > wrote: > >> Hello all I am teaching an intro to early lit class to students new to >> our teacher ed program. >> >> We cover stages of Reading with a strong Chall flavor. I am looking for >> another entry level reading from a more socio-cultural perspective. >> >> Any tips, >> Greg >> > > > > -- > A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being > masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most > soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. > ---George Eliot > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/64d56940/attachment.html From jgregmcverry@gmail.com Thu May 31 12:07:56 2018 From: jgregmcverry@gmail.com (Greg Mcverry) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 15:07:56 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Looking for Reading on Stages of Reading Development In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I know and I thank you for sharing these. iw ill share with my students. I went with Hull, G & Moje E. (nd). What is the Development of Literacy the Development Of?. Understanding Language In a pinch. Here is the module: http://edu305.jgregorymcverry.com/modulefour.html Apologize for the huge splash image trying to learn CSS Grid to make an easy remixable course template for faculty. On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 7:12 PM mike cole wrote: > Here are a couple of papers on literacy, Greg > > I have a few papers on our earlier work on acquisition of reading. The > first link below is a long, detailed draft of a paper that was only > published in full in Russian). It goes beyond Chall in a way you might find > interesting. The second is a paper sort of explaining the link between > still earlier cross-cultural that contains a cut down version of the long > unpublished piece. The last one another short, somewhat different, piece on > the topic of acquisition of reading. > > Contact me directly if you want to follow up. We are particularly focused > on a critique of "level one --> level 2 theories" (with respect to > acquisition of literacy, decoding before comprehension) and try to offer an > empirically grounded alternative. > mike > > http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/NEWTECHN.pdf > > > http://quote.ucsd.edu/lchcautobio/files/2015/08/Cole-1995-Culture-and-Cognitive-Development-PDF.pdf > > http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/MCole/ColeGriffinRemediation.pdf > > > > On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Greg Mcverry > wrote: > >> Hello all I am teaching an intro to early lit class to students new to >> our teacher ed program. >> >> We cover stages of Reading with a strong Chall flavor. I am looking for >> another entry level reading from a more socio-cultural perspective. >> >> Any tips, >> Greg >> > > > > -- > A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being > masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most > soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. > ---George Eliot > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/64d56940/attachment-0001.html From jgregmcverry@gmail.com Thu May 31 12:10:10 2018 From: jgregmcverry@gmail.com (Greg Mcverry) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 15:10:10 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Looking for Reading on Stages of Reading Development In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Too bad science doesn't matter in education research. I mean in the US participating in tiered reading supports (RtI) actually makes kids worse at reading. Can't remember if it was a significant difference but too much money in fidelity to realize flexibility is the key. On Thu, May 31, 2018 at 3:07 PM Greg Mcverry wrote: > I know and I thank you for sharing these. iw ill share with my students. I > went with Hull, G & Moje E. (nd). What is the Development of Literacy the > Development Of?. Understanding Language > In > a pinch. Here is the module: > http://edu305.jgregorymcverry.com/modulefour.html > > Apologize for the huge splash image trying to learn CSS Grid to make an > easy remixable course template for faculty. > > On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 7:12 PM mike cole wrote: > >> Here are a couple of papers on literacy, Greg >> >> I have a few papers on our earlier work on acquisition of reading. The >> first link below is a long, detailed draft of a paper that was only >> published in full in Russian). It goes beyond Chall in a way you might find >> interesting. The second is a paper sort of explaining the link between >> still earlier cross-cultural that contains a cut down version of the long >> unpublished piece. The last one another short, somewhat different, piece on >> the topic of acquisition of reading. >> >> Contact me directly if you want to follow up. We are particularly focused >> on a critique of "level one --> level 2 theories" (with respect to >> acquisition of literacy, decoding before comprehension) and try to offer an >> empirically grounded alternative. >> mike >> >> http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/NEWTECHN.pdf >> >> >> http://quote.ucsd.edu/lchcautobio/files/2015/08/Cole-1995-Culture-and-Cognitive-Development-PDF.pdf >> >> http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/MCole/ColeGriffinRemediation.pdf >> >> >> >> On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Greg Mcverry >> wrote: >> >>> Hello all I am teaching an intro to early lit class to students new to >>> our teacher ed program. >>> >>> We cover stages of Reading with a strong Chall flavor. I am looking for >>> another entry level reading from a more socio-cultural perspective. >>> >>> Any tips, >>> Greg >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being >> masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most >> soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. >> ---George Eliot >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/b4d1e70a/attachment.html From jgregmcverry@gmail.com Thu May 31 12:10:10 2018 From: jgregmcverry@gmail.com (Greg Mcverry) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 15:10:10 -0400 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Looking for Reading on Stages of Reading Development In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Too bad science doesn't matter in education research. I mean in the US participating in tiered reading supports (RtI) actually makes kids worse at reading. Can't remember if it was a significant difference but too much money in fidelity to realize flexibility is the key. On Thu, May 31, 2018 at 3:07 PM Greg Mcverry wrote: > I know and I thank you for sharing these. iw ill share with my students. I > went with Hull, G & Moje E. (nd). What is the Development of Literacy the > Development Of?. Understanding Language > In > a pinch. Here is the module: > http://edu305.jgregorymcverry.com/modulefour.html > > Apologize for the huge splash image trying to learn CSS Grid to make an > easy remixable course template for faculty. > > On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 7:12 PM mike cole wrote: > >> Here are a couple of papers on literacy, Greg >> >> I have a few papers on our earlier work on acquisition of reading. The >> first link below is a long, detailed draft of a paper that was only >> published in full in Russian). It goes beyond Chall in a way you might find >> interesting. The second is a paper sort of explaining the link between >> still earlier cross-cultural that contains a cut down version of the long >> unpublished piece. The last one another short, somewhat different, piece on >> the topic of acquisition of reading. >> >> Contact me directly if you want to follow up. We are particularly focused >> on a critique of "level one --> level 2 theories" (with respect to >> acquisition of literacy, decoding before comprehension) and try to offer an >> empirically grounded alternative. >> mike >> >> http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/NEWTECHN.pdf >> >> >> http://quote.ucsd.edu/lchcautobio/files/2015/08/Cole-1995-Culture-and-Cognitive-Development-PDF.pdf >> >> http://lchc.ucsd.edu/People/MCole/ColeGriffinRemediation.pdf >> >> >> >> On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Greg Mcverry >> wrote: >> >>> Hello all I am teaching an intro to early lit class to students new to >>> our teacher ed program. >>> >>> We cover stages of Reading with a strong Chall flavor. I am looking for >>> another entry level reading from a more socio-cultural perspective. >>> >>> Any tips, >>> Greg >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> A man's mind-what there is of it- has always the advantage of being >> masculine, - as the smallest birch-tree is of a higher kind than the most >> soaring palm, - and even his ignorance is of a sounder quality. >> ---George Eliot >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/b4d1e70a/attachment-0001.html From arturo.escandon@gmail.com Thu May 31 17:16:28 2018 From: arturo.escandon@gmail.com (Arturo Escandon) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2018 09:16:28 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: =?utf-8?q?Filosof=C3=ADa_de_la_ense=C3=B1anza_de_lenguas_extr?= =?utf-8?q?anjeras_=28a_primer_on_CHAT_SCT=29?= In-Reply-To: <1527791520387.27908@iped.uio.no> References: <1527791520387.27908@iped.uio.no> Message-ID: Thank you Alfredo. There aren?t many resources at all. As you know, It is hard to write academically in Spanish because your reach reduces dramatically. So it is a catch-22. No writing, no reading. So at least here I am introducing a basic model of practice in Spanish (a concept) and encouraging to read source materials. It is working so far. I am reaching teachers who start to frame their research projects under models to determine internalisation, for instance. Gracias por tu comentario. Un abrazo. Arturo On Fri, Jun 1, 2018 at 3:33, Alfredo Jornet Gil wrote: > Congratulations for your publication Arturo. I am so disconnected from > Spanish academic literature that I must admit I have no idea which > resources are there for those who work within CHAT frameworks. Surely a > great resource for many on this list and outside it. > > ? > > Un abrazo y mucha suerte con tu proyecto, > Alfredo Jornet > ------------------------------ > New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, > "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print > available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full > > ------------------------------ > *From:* xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu > on behalf of Arturo Escandon > *Sent:* 31 May 2018 08:51 > *To:* eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > *Subject:* [Xmca-l] Filosof?a de la ense?anza de lenguas extranjeras (a > primer on CHAT SCT) > > Hi everyone, > > I just published a week ago a primer on teaching/learning foreign > languages from a dialectic tradition perspective (Hegel, Marx, Vygotsky, > etc.). > > Having the form of an essay, it aims at introducing the dialectic > tradition to language teachers. > > It is part of a project I am working on right now to create groups of > Spanish teachers able to work within the CHAT framework, especially in Japan > > We have so much material in English but so little in Spanish. That is > another reason why I wrote it in Spanish. > > I hope Spanish readers find it useful. > > http://liberaspress.org/fundamentos/filosofiaensenanza/ > > All the best, > > > Arturo > > > Arturo Escand?n, PhD > Professor of Foreign Language Education > Department of Spanish and Latin American Studies > Nanzan University > 18 Yamazato-cho, Showa-ku > Nagoya, 466-8673 JAPAN > > Tel: +81 (52) 832 3111 (extension 3604) > Mobile: +81 (908) 796 4220 > E-mail: escandon@nanzan-u.ac.jp > -- Sent from Gmail Mobile -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180601/cd13a39f/attachment.html From arturo.escandon@gmail.com Thu May 31 17:16:28 2018 From: arturo.escandon@gmail.com (Arturo Escandon) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2018 09:16:28 +0900 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: =?utf-8?q?Filosof=C3=ADa_de_la_ense=C3=B1anza_de_lenguas_extr?= =?utf-8?q?anjeras_=28a_primer_on_CHAT_SCT=29?= In-Reply-To: <1527791520387.27908@iped.uio.no> References: <1527791520387.27908@iped.uio.no> Message-ID: Thank you Alfredo. There aren?t many resources at all. As you know, It is hard to write academically in Spanish because your reach reduces dramatically. So it is a catch-22. No writing, no reading. So at least here I am introducing a basic model of practice in Spanish (a concept) and encouraging to read source materials. It is working so far. I am reaching teachers who start to frame their research projects under models to determine internalisation, for instance. Gracias por tu comentario. Un abrazo. Arturo On Fri, Jun 1, 2018 at 3:33, Alfredo Jornet Gil wrote: > Congratulations for your publication Arturo. I am so disconnected from > Spanish academic literature that I must admit I have no idea which > resources are there for those who work within CHAT frameworks. Surely a > great resource for many on this list and outside it. > > ? > > Un abrazo y mucha suerte con tu proyecto, > Alfredo Jornet > ------------------------------ > New Article in the European Journal of Engineering Education, > "Collaborative design decision-making as social process". Free print > available: https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/vCwCJBcyE5jMiZkZwAWR/full > > ------------------------------ > *From:* xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu > on behalf of Arturo Escandon > *Sent:* 31 May 2018 08:51 > *To:* eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity > *Subject:* [Xmca-l] Filosof?a de la ense?anza de lenguas extranjeras (a > primer on CHAT SCT) > > Hi everyone, > > I just published a week ago a primer on teaching/learning foreign > languages from a dialectic tradition perspective (Hegel, Marx, Vygotsky, > etc.). > > Having the form of an essay, it aims at introducing the dialectic > tradition to language teachers. > > It is part of a project I am working on right now to create groups of > Spanish teachers able to work within the CHAT framework, especially in Japan > > We have so much material in English but so little in Spanish. That is > another reason why I wrote it in Spanish. > > I hope Spanish readers find it useful. > > http://liberaspress.org/fundamentos/filosofiaensenanza/ > > All the best, > > > Arturo > > > Arturo Escand?n, PhD > Professor of Foreign Language Education > Department of Spanish and Latin American Studies > Nanzan University > 18 Yamazato-cho, Showa-ku > Nagoya, 466-8673 JAPAN > > Tel: +81 (52) 832 3111 (extension 3604) > Mobile: +81 (908) 796 4220 > E-mail: escandon@nanzan-u.ac.jp > -- Sent from Gmail Mobile -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180601/cd13a39f/attachment-0001.html From mpacker@cantab.net Thu May 31 17:21:02 2018 From: mpacker@cantab.net (Martin Packer) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 19:21:02 -0500 Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: English translation of Pedology of the Adolescent In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <638F3A0C-07FB-4E2B-ABA1-5662635B44C0@cantab.net> I?m holding my breath...! :) Martin > On May 30, 2018, at 11:04 PM, Larry Smolucha wrote: > > Message from Francine: > > David thank you for the exposition on how the Pedology of the Adolescent has come down to us over the years. It should be available in English for its centennial (2031). > > > ---George Eliot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20180531/8727be6f/attachment.html