[Xmca-l] Re: Having an experience
Beth Ferholt
bferholt@gmail.com
Fri Jul 17 20:55:43 PDT 2015
Yes, that is very helpful, thank you!
I do not think it is ever without another, and thought of this when I read
your recent paper.
You can always perezhivanie with the others in yourself, so long as you
attach the other to something, even to a "past" or "future" self. Virginia
Woolf is very good at showing this. Paley's children in her class appear
to be like Buber, having life stand still here with a cat or even a tree.
Beth
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 11:44 PM, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net> wrote:
> I couldn't tell you that, Beth.
> On Mike's suggestion, you will recall, the discussion of perezhivanie was
> progressed, avoiding cross-cultural difficulties, by a discussion of films!
> There is a movie called "An Education," and there is a passage in this
> movie where the young heroine has this experience, following the revelation
> of how she has been deceived and exploited. It is the moment of
> self-transformation, but that transformation is extended perhaps over a
> period of 24 hours, in silence, in that kind of state. The first movie that
> was discussed was "Brief Encounter" and here that moment of time standing
> still comes at the end of the movie when the heroine reflects on an
> exciting affair and her life with her nice boring husband and sees that her
> life is best just as it is and lets go of her romanticism. In my own life,
> I recall several such time-standing-still moments of transformation. But in
> none of these cases was there a therapist involved. It is an open question
> for me, if you want to give a different name ("meta-perezhivanie") to that
> perezhivanie where the person is able to reflect upon their own experience
> without the aid of another.
>
> Andy
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> *Andy Blunden*
> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
> On 18/07/2015 1:25 PM, Beth Ferholt wrote:
>
>> Which stage according to Vasilyuk's stages is the standing still?
>> Redemption or the smack middle of repentance, when you can see both
>> directions at once? Beth
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 11:11 PM, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>> wrote:
>>
>> According to Mikhail Munipov (whom you have met on
>> FaceBook, Beth) that process of "life standing still"
>> is characteristic of the cathartic moment of a
>> perezhivanie.
>> And David, if I associate catharsis with perezhivanie
>> I am more referring to its meaning in Greek drama, not
>> 19th century medicine or Freudian psychoanalysis, all
>> of these being derivatives of the original Greek, I think,
>>
>> Andy
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> *Andy Blunden*
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> On 18/07/2015 1:03 PM, Beth Ferholt wrote:
>>
>> Yes, this really makes sense! So it is the doing
>> that is the practical energy. SO Marx was writing
>> about a method of perezhivanie?
>>
>> I may be conflating things but I am trying to
>> piece together several pieces (like how in a big
>> city you know a whole neighborhood as a world unto
>> itself, and then you find out it is in the same
>> area as another neighborhood that you know well --
>> but you did not know they were connected -- ).
>>
>> Actually that process of piecing together across
>> the gaps is also related to what we are talking
>> about. Of course. When you age in a city you also
>> have the depth of the memories in layers at a
>> given place, and this stringing together across
>> time and place is what Virginia Woolf calls life:
>> moments in which "life stands still her" strung
>> together like a strand of pearls = with gaps
>> between them.
>>
>> Beth
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 10:42 PM, Andy Blunden
>> <ablunden@mira.net <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>>> wrote:
>>
>> Like you, Beth, I have found this xmca thread
>> particularly exciting!
>> There is one thing I'd like to add, which is
>> implicit
>> in Mike's quote from Marx:
>>
>> https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1844/manuscripts/comm.htm#art
>> which is that Dewey holds an experience to be both
>> suffering and *doing* [Tatigkeit in German].
>> The doing means that an experience (to be an
>> experience, and stand out from the background of
>> experience, have significance and form a whole)
>> entails wilfully changing the world, even if that
>> changing is trivial, such as changing other
>> people's
>> attitudes to you or most trivially changing
>> how you
>> henceforth interact with a certain kind of
>> situation,
>> person or whatever. But doing is doing, it is
>> not just
>> going through the motions or habit. And that
>> is why
>> experiences in this sense are so important to the
>> development of the personality and the world,
>>
>> Andy
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> *Andy Blunden*
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>>
>> On 18/07/2015 4:40 AM, Beth Ferholt wrote:
>>
>> This chain of ideas is the closest I have ever
>> felt to what interests me
>> most. It covers all the interests that
>> brought me
>> first to play and then
>> to the playworlds and then to
>> perezhivanie. Before I went to LCHC I was a
>> preschool teacher and this is a profession
>> that I
>> think can be described as
>> being, in its first part, responsible for
>> reflecting upon the 'having an
>> experience' that is happening all around
>> you every
>> day (time is so
>> condensed for young children so it is
>> happening
>> all the time) so that you
>> can support the self-creation beings who
>> are able
>> to "have an experience''?
>>
>> Like with Greg's students, as a preschool
>> teacher
>> you find that what is
>> most important is to describe what is
>> happening in
>> a way that is true to
>> the children's experiences. Vivian Paley
>> shows us
>> how to do this. If you
>> don;t do this you find dealing with the
>> Golem who
>> has had the words that
>> give it life removed from its mouth: you
>> just have
>> dirt, nothing even
>> remotely related to the Golem, not even
>> weight.
>>
>> I think it is the teacher/artists who can
>> find for
>> us those properties that
>> will characterize the experience as a
>> whole. What
>> Monica named 'preschool
>> didactics from within' is a process of working
>> with these people in
>> research. This sounds like 5D.
>>
>> Andy, Vygotsky is talking about the the two
>> purposes of art criticism. One
>> is entirely in the domain of social life,
>> he says,
>> guiding what art creates
>> in its audience in useful directions. The
>> other
>> is to 'conserve the effect
>> of art as art'. He says we know this is
>> needed,
>> because art is a unity,
>> and without the whole criticism is not
>> related to
>> art -- he calls what we
>> have left, without the unity, a wound. But
>> criticism of art treats art as
>> a parliamentary speech -- often -- he
>> says. Vygtosky shows how to avoid
>> this in the chapter on Bunin's short story.
>>
>> As a preschool teacher you know that art
>> is life
>> because if you forget this
>> then you have unhappy children and your job is
>> impossible, or worse. As an
>> researcher, every time you hit something
>> hard you
>> can revert to the first
>> purpose of art/life criticism, or anyhow
>> to the
>> part that does not conserve
>> the effect, without any consequences on your
>> livelihood. If we could have
>> a system of science that makes it
>> impossible to
>> leave the hardest questions
>> to the first purpose of criticism, then we
>> could
>> have so many people
>> working on these hardest questions in a
>> meaningful
>> way, but I do not know
>> how to do this even in my own work.
>>
>> Except one way is to place the desires of the
>> teachers and children before
>> your own. This is sort of a method of love or
>> empathy. Kiyo suggested The
>> Method of Hope by Miyazaki (no relation I
>> think)
>> and this is related, also
>> Edith Turner's work where she sees the reality
>> that the people she is
>> studying see.
>>
>> Maybe it is a method of perezhivanie.
>>
>> Beth
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 1:58 PM, Alfredo
>> Jornet
>> Gil <a.j.gil@iped.uio.no
>> <mailto:a.j.gil@iped.uio.no>
>> <mailto:a.j.gil@iped.uio.no
>> <mailto:a.j.gil@iped.uio.no>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Mike, could you elaborate on that?
>>
>> Alfredo
>> ________________________________________
>> From:
>> xmca-l-bounces+a.g.jornet=
>> iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu>>
>> <xmca-l-bounces+a.g.jornet=
>> iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu>>> on
>> behalf of
>> mike cole <mcole@ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:mcole@ucsd.edu> <mailto:mcole@ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:mcole@ucsd.edu>>>
>> Sent: 17 July 2015 19:40
>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Having an experience
>>
>> Alfredo--
>>
>> a "method of organization" seems close
>> to a
>> synonym for design.
>>
>> mike
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 9:42 AM, Alfredo
>> Jornet Gil <a.j.gil@iped.uio.no
>> <mailto:a.j.gil@iped.uio.no>
>> <mailto:a.j.gil@iped.uio.no
>>
>> <mailto:a.j.gil@iped.uio.no>>>
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I like very much how Greg brings in a
>> methodological issue here with his
>> mention about ethnography and his
>> reading
>> of "fidelity"; that the latter
>>
>> is
>>
>> not about representing exactly,
>> but about
>> describing events in terms of
>> consequences for the participants,
>> which
>> they display for each other in
>> their actual practice.
>>
>> This methodological aspect makes
>> me think
>> that the the notion of ANALYSIS
>> BY UNITS, which has been discussed
>> in xmca
>> before, is useful here. Unit
>> analysis reminds us that, as units,
>> experiences, as concrete and real
>> phenomena, have some form of
>> organization
>> that extends in time. That is
>> why, if I understood the
>> discussion below
>> correctly, Beth is warned not
>>
>> to
>>
>> think of the unit of experience as
>> a unit
>> "in itself".
>>
>> Dewey and Bentley 1949 made the
>> differentiation between
>> self-action and
>> transaction. In self action,
>> things are
>> explained by their own powers.
>>
>> This
>>
>> is, I believe, what Vygotsky would
>> have
>> referred to as analysis by
>> elements. In transaction, they say,
>> “deal[s] with aspects and phases of
>> action, without final attribution to
>> ‘elements’ or other presumptively
>> detachable ‘entities,’ ‘essences,’ or
>> ‘realities,’ and without isolation
>>
>> of
>>
>> presumptively detachable
>> ‘relations’ from
>> such detachable ‘elements’”. An
>> experience can be studied precisely
>> because it is not a thing in itself:
>>
>> it
>>
>> is always a moving, gesture, a
>> "method of
>> organization" as Dewey &
>>
>> Bentley
>>
>> write.
>>
>> I thought this my add something to
>> your
>> fascinating discussion,
>> Alfredo
>>
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> From:
>> xmca-l-bounces+a.g.jornet=
>> iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu>>
>> <xmca-l-bounces+a.g.jornet=
>> iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:iped.uio.no@mailman.ucsd.edu>>> on
>> behalf of
>> mike cole <mcole@ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:mcole@ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:mcole@ucsd.edu
>>
>> <mailto:mcole@ucsd.edu>>>
>> Sent: 17 July 2015 18:23
>> To: Andy Blunden; eXtended Mind,
>> Culture,
>> Activity
>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Having an
>> experience
>>
>> Marx: It is only in a social
>> context that
>> subjectivism and objectivism,
>> spiritualism and materialism,
>> activity and
>> passivity, cease to be
>> antinomies and thus cease to exist
>> as such
>> antinomies. The resolution of
>> the theoretical contradictions is
>> possible
>> only through practical means,
>> only through the practical energy
>> of man.
>> Their resolution is not by any
>> means, therefore, only a problem of
>> knowledge, but is a real problem of
>> life which philosophy was unable
>> to solve
>> precisely because it saw there
>>
>> a
>>
>> purely theoretical problem."
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 10:45 PM, Andy
>> Blunden <ablunden@mira.net
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>>>
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> No, no, Beth. As Dewey says:
>>
>> "This unity is neither
>> emotional,
>> practical, nor
>> intellectual, for these
>> terms name
>> distinctions that
>> reflection can make within
>> it. In
>> discourse//about//an
>> experience, we must make
>> use of
>> these adjectives of
>> interpretation. In going
>> over an
>> experience in
>> mind//after/ /its
>> occurrence, we
>> may find that one
>> property rather than
>> another was
>> sufficiently dominant
>> so that it characterizes the
>> experience as a whole."
>>
>> Isn't this beautiful
>> scientific prose!
>> We make these distinction when
>>
>> we
>>
>> *reflect* on an experience. And
>> perhaps we include the
>> experience in
>>
>> our
>>
>> autobiography, act it out on the
>> stage, analyse it
>> scientifically, all
>>
>> of
>>
>> which presupposes analysis and
>> synthesis. But it is important to
>>
>> recognise
>>
>> that the unity is prior. It is not
>> only a unity of emotion and
>>
>> cognition
>>
>> (for example) but also of
>> attention
>> and will - and any other
>> categories
>>
>> you
>>
>> abstract from an experience.
>>
>> Andy
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> *Andy Blunden*
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>>
>> On 17/07/2015 3:00 PM, Beth
>> Ferholt wrote:
>>
>> Or reproducing the part that
>> represents the whole? Like a
>> fractal? I
>> think it is the similarity
>> across
>> scales that makes an
>> experience
>> proleptic, or gives that
>> 'bliss
>> conferred at the beginning
>> of the road
>>
>> to
>>
>> redemption" that Vasilyuk
>> refers
>> to. You have an experience on
>>
>> several
>>
>> timescales and so a sense of
>> deja-vu is central to
>> having an
>>
>> experience.
>>
>> This is what I am thinking
>> about
>> after reading both the
>> paper of
>>
>> Dewey's
>>
>> and your recent piece on
>> perezhivanie, Andy,
>> although I am
>> picking up
>>
>> on a
>>
>> small piece of the last
>> email in
>> this chain -- : If
>> something is only
>> itself in its whole then
>> you can't
>> study it, is what is
>> bothering me.
>>
>> Beth
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at
>> 11:22 PM,
>> Andy Blunden
>> <ablunden@mira.net <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>>
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>
>>
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net
>> <mailto:ablunden@mira.net>>>> wrote:
>>
>> Not "getting at
>> something",
>> Michael. Just pursuing
>> this question you raised
>> about Dewey's saying that the
>> aesthetic quality of
>> medieval
>> buildings arises from
>> their not being "planned"
>> like buildings are nowadays.
>> He goes on to say
>> "Every work
>> of art follows the plan
>> of, and pattern of, a
>> complete experience." The
>> puzzle
>> he is raising here is the
>> completeness of an
>> experience which
>> gives it its
>> aesthetic quality, and
>> this cannot be created by
>> assembling together parts in
>> the way a modern
>> building is
>> planned. An experience -
>> the kind of thing which
>> sticks in your mind - is an
>> original or prior
>> unity, not
>> a combination, and this
>> is what gives a work
>> of art
>> that ineffable quality,
>> something which can
>> only be
>> transmitted by reproducing
>> that whole of an
>> experience.
>>
>> Andy
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> *Andy Blunden*
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> <
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> On 17/07/2015 2:32 AM,
>> Glassman, Michael wrote:
>>
>> Andy,
>>
>> I'm still not
>> sure about
>> your question. Did I set
>> out to have that
>> experience, that
>> morning...no, I
>> don't think so
>> (it was a
>> long time ago, but I'm
>> pretty sure no).
>> Could I
>> have just treated it as
>> an indiscriminate
>> activity, probably, I had done
>> so before.
>>
>> But I am guessing
>> you're
>> getting a something here
>> Andy?
>>
>> Michael
>>
>> -----Original
>> Message-----
>> From:
>> xmca-l-bounces+glassman.13=osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>>
>> <mailto:
>> osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>>>
>> [mailto:xmca-l-bounces+glassman.13
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%2Bglassman.13>
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%2Bglassman.13
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%252Bglassman.13>>
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%2Bglassman.13
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%252Bglassman.13>
>> <mailto:
>> xmca-l-bounces%252Bglassman.13
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%25252Bglassman.13>>>=
>>
>> osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>>
>>
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>>
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:osu.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>>>] On
>> Behalf Of
>> Andy Blunden
>> Sent: Thursday,
>> July 16,
>> 2015 12:21 PM
>> To: eXtended Mind,
>> Culture, Activity
>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re:
>> Having an experience
>>
>> YOu said: "...
>> But that
>> time I had the experience
>> with the
>> paintings..."
>>
>> I mean that was an
>> experience. Did you set out
>> that morning to
>> have that
>> experience?
>> RE, your
>> question: "what
>> does he mean when he says
>> you can't do things
>> indiscriminately and have
>> vital experience,
>> but you
>> also can't plan things?"
>> Andy
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> *Andy Blunden*
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> <
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> On 17/07/2015
>> 2:09 AM,
>> Glassman, Michael wrote:
>>
>> Well I'm not
>> sure I
>> understand your question
>> Andy, but
>> perhaps it has
>> something to
>> do with
>> my grandfather's favorite
>> saying
>> (translated from
>> Yiddish),
>>
>> Man plans,
>> God laughs.
>>
>> Michael
>>
>> -----Original
>> Message-----
>> From:
>> xmca-l-bounces+mglassman=
>>
>> ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:
>> ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>>
>>
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:
>> ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>>>
>> [mailto:xmca-l-bounces+mglassman
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%2Bmglassman>
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%2Bmglassman
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%252Bmglassman>>
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%2Bmglassman
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%252Bmglassman>
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%252Bmglassman
>> <mailto:xmca-l-bounces%25252Bmglassman>>>=
>> ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>>
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:
>> ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:ehe.ohio-state.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>>>]
>> On Behalf Of
>> Andy Blunden
>> Sent:
>> Thursday, July
>> 16, 2015 12:04 PM
>> To:
>> xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> <mailto:xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>>
>> <mailto:xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>>
>> <mailto:xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> <mailto:xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>>>
>> Subject:
>> [Xmca-l] Re:
>> Having an experience
>>
>> So Michael,
>> there was
>> just that one occasion,
>> in all your
>> museum-going, when you had an
>> experience.
>> Was that
>> planned?
>> (I don't mean
>> to say
>> you haven't had a number
>> of such
>> experiences,
>> Michael ...
>> just some
>> number actually)
>>
>> Andy
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> *Andy Blunden*
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> <
>> http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>> <http://home.pacific.net.au/%7Eandy/>
>>
>> On 17/07/2015
>> 1:19
>> AM, Glassman, Michael wrote:
>>
>> Hi Larry
>> and all,
>>
>> I think
>> this is
>> one of the most complex
>> aspects of
>> experience, what does he mean
>> when he
>> says you
>> can't do things
>> indiscriminately
>> and have vital
>> experience, but
>> you also can't plan
>> things? I have
>> discussed (argued) about
>> this a
>> lot with
>> my students. I have
>> especially seen
>> him raise this point in at
>> least two
>> of his
>> great works, Democracy
>> and
>> Education and
>> Experience and Nature -
>> and again of
>> course in Art as Experience
>> (notice
>> he is not
>> saying how Art enters
>> into
>> experience
>> but how art is experience
>> - I have
>> come to
>> notice these little
>> things
>> more and
>> more in his writing).
>>
>> The
>> difficulty we
>> have, at least in the
>> United States
>> because of the dominance of
>> the idea of
>> meta-cognition, is that we too
>> often
>> translate
>> what individuals are
>> bringing
>> in to
>> experience to organize it
>> as a form of
>> meta-cognition. It is kind
>> of
>> possible to
>> make that interpretation
>> from
>> Democracy
>> and Education, although
>> what I
>> think he
>> is doing more is arguing
>> against
>> misinterpretations of his
>> work as
>> random, child
>> centered activities. I
>> think he is
>> clearer in Experience and
>> Nature
>> that we
>> bring in who we are at the
>> moment
>> into the
>> activity, and use who we
>> are (I
>> don't want
>> to say identity) as an
>> organizing
>> principle for what we do. It
>> is
>> perhaps one of
>> the places where Dewey
>> and
>> Vygotsky are
>> close. Perhaps I can use
>> the same
>> Jackson
>> Pollock example. The
>> first few
>> times I
>> saw his paintings I was
>> trying to
>> "apprecitate" them because
>> I was
>> told that
>> was the
>> best way to experience
>> them. Dewey says
>> no vital experience
>> there
>> because my
>> activities become stilted
>> and artificia
>> l.
>> Sometimes
>> I went through the
>> museum
>> and just
>> looked at pictures, one to
>> the other. No
>> vital experience there,
>> just random
>> threads. But that time I had
>> the
>> experience
>> with the paintings I was
>> allowing
>> who I
>> was, what had been built up
>> in the
>> trajectory
>> of my life to enter into
>> my experience
>> with the painting, making it
>> a vital
>> experience. I think Dewey
>> makes
>> the
>> argument in
>> Experience and Nature that
>> it is not
>> just
>> the experience the moment
>> before,
>> but the
>> experiences leading to
>> that
>> experience,
>> the context of my life,
>> of my
>> parent's
>> life, of a long line of
>> historical
>> experiences.
>>
>> Anyway,
>> my take.
>>
>> Michael
>>
>> -
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Beth Ferholt
>> Assistant Professor
>> Department of Early
>> Childhood and
>> Art Education
>> Brooklyn College, City
>> University
>> of New York
>> 2900 Bedford Avenue
>> Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889
>>
>> Email:
>> bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu>
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu>>
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu>
>>
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu>>>
>> Phone: (718) 951-5205
>> <tel:%28718%29%20951-5205>
>> <tel:%28718%29%20951-5205>
>> <tel:%28718%29%20951-5205>
>> Fax: (718) 951-4816
>> <tel:%28718%29%20951-4816>
>> <tel:%28718%29%20951-4816>
>> <tel:%28718%29%20951-4816>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Both environment and species
>> change in the
>> course of time, and thus
>> ecological niches are not stable
>> and given
>> forever (Polotova & Storch,
>> Ecological Niche, 2008)
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Both environment and species change in the
>> course of time, and thus
>> ecological niches are not stable and given
>> forever (Polotova & Storch,
>> Ecological Niche, 2008)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- Beth Ferholt
>> Assistant Professor
>> Department of Early Childhood and Art Education
>> Brooklyn College, City University of New York
>> 2900 Bedford Avenue
>> Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889
>>
>> Email: bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu>
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
>> <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu>>
>> Phone: (718) 951-5205 <tel:%28718%29%20951-5205>
>> Fax: (718) 951-4816 <tel:%28718%29%20951-4816>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Beth Ferholt
>> Assistant Professor
>> Department of Early Childhood and Art Education
>> Brooklyn College, City University of New York
>> 2900 Bedford Avenue
>> Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889
>>
>> Email: bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu <mailto:bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu>
>> Phone: (718) 951-5205
>> Fax: (718) 951-4816
>>
>
>
--
Beth Ferholt
Assistant Professor
Department of Early Childhood and Art Education
Brooklyn College, City University of New York
2900 Bedford Avenue
Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889
Email: bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
Phone: (718) 951-5205
Fax: (718) 951-4816
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